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 Post subject: New puzzle (sorry... not revealed... at least not yet!)
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 12:04 am 
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Last night I confessed to three friends of a new puzzle. I am trying really hard to not tell what it is before I finalise some actions, while at the same time I want to tell everyone about it... :?
(trust me... it is a very tough situation)

But when the right time comes, you will all hear a story. A story of a fully functional puzzle that many thought was impossible!

Hint experssion:nuclear sign...! (don't worry, it has nothing to do with radiation)

8-)



Pantazis


PS I can't say anything more, but you may all speculate - those who know, please reveal neither the design nor who you are LOL

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 12:51 am 
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Could it be a Magic that transforms from a Nuclear Hazard to a Biohazard?




. . . :shock:

On second thought, that probably wasn't such a healthy suggestion...

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 1:18 am 
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VeryWetPaint wrote:
Could it be a Magic that transforms from a Nuclear Hazard to a Biohazard?




. . . :shock:

On second thought, that probably wasn't such a healthy suggestion...



LOL it has nothing to do with anything dangerous. It is just a hint expression which is directly related to the puzzle, but it may confuse more rather than help! ;)



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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 1:42 am 
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Ack! How early do you need to get up around here?!?! Are you saying you beat me to it!? Inconceivable!

:)

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 1:54 am 
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the.drizzle wrote:
Ack! How early do you need to get up around here?!?! Are you saying you beat me to it!? Inconceivable!

:)



naaah... I did not modify any UFO puzzle LOL

I specialise in another area! ;)



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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 2:17 am 
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The UFO is a "dry run" for the big guns, which will be pulled out next ;)

Figured I'd try something with some "simple" geometry first, for practice.

Oohh, the anticipation...

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 2:38 am 
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the.drizzle wrote:
The UFO is a "dry run" for the big guns, which will be pulled out next ;)

Figured I'd try something with some "simple" geometry first, for practice.

Oohh, the anticipation...



Just give me a few days LOL
Until then, I could give some more vague answers! :P



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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 3:09 am 
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I'm thinking some non-closed single looped double stringed 100 tile magic! (I just made that sound fantsay!)

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 3:13 am 
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I'm guessing something like this?

Thomas


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 3:15 am 
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joey wrote:
I'm thinking some non-closed single looped double stringed 100 tile magic! (I just made that sound fantsay!)



LOL good try, but this is not the case. I have a prototype, but proper components to build it, do not exist to date. :P




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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 3:17 am 
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Thomas wrote:
I'm guessing something like this?

Thomas



Let me guess... this must be.... Xerxes, right? :P
(yes this is getting near to the clue, but still, not quite LOL)



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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 6:52 am 
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kastellorizo wrote:
Just give me a few days LOL.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 7:11 am 
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Mabye it's a supernova mod that was thought impossible.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 7:25 am 
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Triangle magic.


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 7:33 am 
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Stefan wrote:
Triangle magic.


That's my guess too.


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 9:21 am 
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*whistles indifferently*

I will not say yet what shape it is, but all sides communicate with each other, while the stringing and the stability of the puzzle is always preserved the same way it is preserved in a Rubik's magic.

Because some of you asked, no, it is not a square, or rhombus, or any type of four sided shape. It is canonical with odd number of sides!
Therefore, triangle is not out of the question. ;)

Soon all will know. But one thing's for sure... it's alive! IT'S ALIVE!!!

:P



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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 9:38 am 
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Although I think it will be a 'triangle' Magic, a 'pentagonal' Magic also fits your description: twistypuzzles.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=37684#37684

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 9:58 am 
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Gotcha!

On Wed Aug 02, 2006 5:51 pm kastellorizo wrote at viewtopic.php?p=35572#35572:

kastellorizo wrote:
PS In fact I am planning to send some trinagle ones for 3-d printing as I have a 3-d file format ready.... but I have no time! LOL
(the triangle lines looks exactly like the ones on a triangular side of the Trajber's Octahedron http://twistypuzzles.com/cgi-bin/puzzle.cgi?pid=401)


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Last edited by Thomas on Mon May 07, 2007 10:26 am, edited 4 times in total.

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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 10:03 am 
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Thomas wrote:
Gotcha!


Detective Thomas!

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 10:30 am 
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LOL it's impossible to keep anything unsolved here!

Stefan immediately fount it, his laconic expression was succinct and to the point. But there was also some research by Thomas to verify it!

It is indeed the best project I have done so far regarding puzzles.
I am trying to push things faster to release more information as soon as possible.

:)


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PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2007 1:01 pm 
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[Insert praise and calling you the Magic God (again)]


Taking it to a new level. Nice. I'm very interested in how this design would work (fold).

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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 1:48 am 
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NoahH wrote:
Taking it to a new level. Nice. I'm very interested in how this design would work (fold).


Thanks Noah!

It works same way as a rubik's magic. That is, one tile goes around the other one and meets all sides on the way. Jaap has made a very good comment some time ago. He said that some strings could get tangled. There is indeed a restriction when compared to an even numbered magic, but that does not stop it from being fully working puzzle and having the pieces go around 360 degrees. After all, it is very rare when a move of more than 360 degrees is performed on a normal Rubik's magic.

Someone also said that since hexagonal tiles were made in the past, triangle ones are easier. That is not true from what I have seen. There is a huge difference, because the design of a triangle magic cannot be balanced if we have only two corners (and no sides) adjacent.

Regarding the prototypes, I never managed to order them. But I did make some of my own using home made materials LOL
The reason I used the expression "nuclear sign" is because the stringing pattern looks like one. But that is only half of the story. And although the pattern is following the Rubik's magic logic (but for triangles), the placement of the strings is a completely different story. And this is where many had failed.

Moreover, I have made not one, but two completely different stringing patterns (i.e. they look like different puzzles), and both of them work nicely. The same technique can be made for pentagonal magics. Just like the triangles, the pattern is revealed easily, just by following the logic of an extension of a Rubik's magic. But the stringing is (again) a very complex issue. But I assure you all, it *can* be done!!!

Maybe I should make a short video with two triangle tiles? ;)

:)


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 7:32 am 
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kastellorizo wrote:
Maybe I should make a short video with two triangle tiles? ;)

:)
Pantazis


I would like to see that.

My biggest problem is trying to figure out how the grooves in the tile go.

Pardon my rough sketches.


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 8:30 am 
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kastellorizo wrote:

Maybe I should make a short video with two triangle tiles? ;)

:)


Pantazis


Take out the word maybe and switch the question mark to an exclamation point and i'll totally agree with you.

with tiles i could see these easily being produced... If you have standard string lengths you could get those from the current sources... A place like http://www.protomold.com or one that is similar, ought to be able to make a mold and spit out the injection molded triangles at a reasonable price. (With only one mold needed to be made, you could even go the full production route)


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 9:32 am 
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NoahH wrote:
kastellorizo wrote:
Maybe I should make a short video with two triangle tiles? ;)

:)
Pantazis


I would like to see that.

My biggest problem is trying to figure out how the grooves in the tile go.

Pardon my rough sketches.


Good try, but not near enough. This is where you must use my hint expression! ;)




Joe Schmoe wrote:
Take out the word maybe and switch the question mark to an exclamation point and i'll totally agree with you.

with tiles i could see these easily being produced... If you have standard string lengths you could get those from the current sources... A place like http://www.protomold.com or one that is similar, ought to be able to make a mold and spit out the injection molded triangles at a reasonable price. (With only one mold needed to be made, you could even go the full production route)


Good point, production procedure has actually started, but I am not sure how long it will take.
Regarding the video, I would prefer to make one when I have some shiny transapernt sharp cut tiles with a nice theme, rather than using a few home made single colored tiles LOL




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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 9:43 am 
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kastellorizo wrote:

Good try, but not near enough. This is where you must use my hint expression! ;)


The Nuclear Sign hint? I thought that would be the shape of the entire puzzle, not the stringing techinique.

kastellorizo wrote:
Regarding the video, I would prefer to make one when I have some shiny transapernt sharp cut tiles with a nice theme, rather than using a few home made single colored tiles LOL

Pantazis


Even to show some basic movements? I mean, a completed puzzle is different than just 2 pieces showing how they move. I think it would be great to give us a visual teaser before we see the even more impressing final product.

Then again, I'm just eager to see your masterpiece (to date).

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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 12:03 pm 
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NoahH wrote:
The Nuclear Sign hint? I thought that would be the shape of the entire puzzle, not the stringing techinique.


Well, I am tempted to answer this, but I need to leave some mystery hanging in the air LOL



NoahH wrote:
Even to show some basic movements? I mean, a completed puzzle is different than just 2 pieces showing how they move. I think it would be great to give us a visual teaser before we see the even more impressing final product.
Then again, I'm just eager to see your masterpiece (to date).


If you have MSN, I could demonstrate my test tiles for you LOL

:)



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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 12:54 pm 
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kastellorizo wrote:
NoahH wrote:
The Nuclear Sign hint? I thought that would be the shape of the entire puzzle, not the stringing techinique.


Well, I am tempted to answer this, but I need to leave some mystery hanging in the air LOL


I understand. It's ok. But can you tell me when you will be able to reveal this project, or is it just up to how fast it takes the production place?



kastellerizo wrote:
If you have MSN, I could demonstrate my test tiles for you LOL

:)

Pantazis


I do. I'll try being on whenever I am home. (I'm at school for anoteher 3 hours.)

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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 1:44 pm 
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Judging from your post on 2 August 2006, where you say that the triangle lines look exactly like the ones on a triangular side of the Trajber's Octahedron, I'd say it's the one on the left.

Judging from the first post in this thread, where you say 'nuclear sign', I'd say it's the one on the right.

But then again, you also said you have two different designs. So it's probably both.

Still, I can't see how this should work. I also tried triangle Magics once, and I failed. Although, as I told you in a PM lately, I was able to connect two pyramids with a Magic like stringing. On these the patterns were like the one on the right, so they resembled a Pyraminx.

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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 1:49 pm 
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NoahH wrote:
I understand. It's ok. But can you tell me when you will be able to reveal this project, or is it just up to how fast it takes the production place?


Most of the procedures do not depend on me... :(





NoahH wrote:
I do. I'll try being on whenever I am home. (I'm at school for anoteher 3 hours.)


I will be sleeping by then! I am in KangarooLand!!! LOL






Thomas wrote:
Judging from your post on 2 August 2006, where you say that the triangle lines look exactly like the ones on a triangular side of the Trajber's Octahedron, I'd say it's the one on the left.

Judging from the first post in this thread, where you say 'nuclear sign', I'd say it's the one on the right.

But then again, you also said you have two different designs. So it's probably both.

Still, I can't see how this should work. I also tried triangle Magics once, and I failed. Although, as I told you in a PM lately, I was able to connect two pyramids with a Magic like stringing. On these the patterns were like the one on the right, so they resembled a Pyraminx.

Thomas



Yes Thomas, those are the two designs, and these are indeed how the paths are supposed to be. They are in fact the same design, the left being the "strectched" cousin of the right.

But to make them work, there is still some other things to do!

;)



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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 2:09 pm 
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I got as far as a sketch of the paths, but did not find the solution to the string crossing error. I am sure that it would be much easier to figure it out if I had a set of tiles to test out, but I am working on other projects. I will leave this one up to Dr. Magic, PhD. (at least when he finishes his degree..)

Here is my "sketch". (Red is over, Blue is under) I have also included a blank "sketch" if anyone has any ideas...


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 2:37 pm 
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Puzzlemaster42 wrote:
I got as far as a sketch of the paths, but did not find the solution to the string crossing error. I am sure that it would be much easier to figure it out if I had a set of tiles to test out, but I am working on other projects. I will leave this one up to Dr. Magic, PhD. (at least when he finishes his degree..)

Here is my "sketch". (Red is over, Blue is under) I have also included a blank "sketch" if anyone has any ideas...



This lovely 6-tile sketch shown above, represents one of the first thoughts for a flat triangle magic. Regarding the stringing, even by having tiles, it is not that easy, and although I have got the movement working, I haven't mastered it yet. I am sure many have tried before as this is not a difficult puzzle to construct.

And as much as it sounds strange, not many will choose a 4-tile (that could become a tetrahedron), but will choose a 6-tile, because of the natural way a triangle is spread around! :)

But I'll be honest, my main goal from the start was to make a beautiful octahedron!
(something I could not do with those square tiles)

;)



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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 4:11 pm 
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This is my idea of how it looks. Sorry no pictures. Basicly I think its more or less the same way the magic square looks like. What I mean is you have a triangle and you have a smaller one in the center of it turned turned 60 degrees so the strings can go through. I still think you should make a hexagonal version magic.


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 4:57 pm 
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http://www.kastellorizo.org/puzzles/spo ... exagon.htm

Thought you would have known of this Darren.

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Pembo wrote:
http://www.kastellorizo.org/puzzles/spotlight/flexible_hexagon.htm

Thought you would have known of this Darren.


Yes I do know of that magic. I just don't trust/like how the stringing is done. The square I'd feel much more comfy to play with because the strings are all going towards the center. I do love this magic though.


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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 9:16 pm 
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Darren, if you follow the square logic, you can indeed make a hexagonal magic with a different stringing when compared to the Flexible Hexagon.

Life is so much simpler for even-numbered side polygons!

:)



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PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2007 11:50 pm 
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kastellorizo wrote:
Darren, if you follow the square logic, you can indeed make a hexagonal magic with a different stringing when compared to the Flexible Hexagon.

Life is so much simpler for even-numbered side polygons!

:)



Pantazis
Does this mean we will be seeing Octagon magics soon?

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PostPosted: Wed May 09, 2007 12:29 am 
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NoahH wrote:
Does this mean we will be seeing Octagon magics soon?


As the angles get wider and wider, stability may be in peril!

But, ok ok... it *does* work!!! ;)



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PostPosted: Sun May 13, 2007 2:11 am 
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Pantazis, any developments yet?

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Thomas wrote:
Pantazis, any developments yet?

Thomas



There isn't any interesting update yet. Some things are not under my control and sadly I cannot make them go faster. But slowly or not, things are moving! ;)

And when the time is right, I will post news immediately. The overall procedure of releasing some new puzzle *does* take time, and I am trying really hard to have EVERYTHING ready before August. I am more impatient than anyone else about this, trust me!!!

:)




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