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 Post subject: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 5:09 pm 
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Hello all. I am posting as a newcomer here on recommendation from one of this forum's members.

Sometime, perhaps a year ago, I found a small twisty at a flea market in Manhattan being sold by a dealer in Russian artifacts of different types. I was charmed by it and bought it for a few dollars. I am a sometimes shape collector, although most of my twisties are new. Recently, I happened into references to twisty dominos on several sites you are all familiar with, including this one.

I would be very interested in hearing your thoughts on the one I have, because it is different from any of the dominos described on those sites.

Here is the address of my images of that domino, and notes, along with some images to help compare it to other dominos.

http://worldTWISTYFORUMbuilding.org/Oth ... Domino.htm (Copy and past this address and then remove the TWISTYFORUM which is there to prevent unwanted indexing and mailings.)

I've pieced together an understanding of that there are two domino mechanisms (split core and groove), that there are two exteriors (painted, and raised but not painted), and two names, Rubik's Domino (1979) and Magic Domino (1982). I'm guessing that the two names may go with the two mechanism versions (and could correspond with Hungarian and American distribution and patents), and that there might be a painted and raised-pip version of each version. That would make four different dominos. Do you happen to know if I have that all right? Much of it is a guess.

I have not opened the domino in question yet - I do not want to risk damaging it. It's also interesting to try to deduce its history from the outside for now. My guess, having never taken one apart and being unfamiliar with twisty mechanisms, is that it is a solid core (as opposed to split core) spindle prototype (or, less likely, early release or variation). The notes and pictures go into reasons for hypothosizing that. This guess keeps the piecing together of information interesting for me. Any of you might, I realize, have much more certain information. In any case, I'd like to hear your thoughts.

Thank you, to the managers of these sites and for the information all of you post so freely here.


PS: If this topic sounds familiar, it may be because Sandy kindly opened a discussion on this topic a number of days ago)


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 5:57 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 2:15 am
Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
Nice find

In the 1980's many Rusian puzzles appeared , sometimes copies and sometimes the same puzzle but in a different size or variations.

I think this is a Rusian variation of the Rubik's Domino

Ton


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sat Dec 13, 2003 7:56 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 6:14 am
Location: Orange County, CA, USA
This is actually very similar to a 3x3x4 prototype I was working on. The internal mechanism is anchored to a single edge piece which is enough to keep everything in alignment. I bet that this mechanism turns smoother than the groove version and is possibly better than the spindle type.

And here I thought I was actually coming up with my own semi-unique mechanism. I guess I should just scrap my 3x3x4.


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:19 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 24, 2002 1:10 am
Location: Toronto, Canada
Fascinating. I was incorrectly assuming it was an official prototype or similar since I'd never heard of a Russian copy. I am surprised to hear others have heard of and even own it.

One of you lucky buggers really should contribute some pictures of it to TwistyPuzzles.com! Please!

Sandy


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 8:38 am 
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Thank you Ton, Juozas, and Aleksey for identifying the probable source of this domino and for background on the variations on twisties produced in the Soviet Union. If you have any more details, I imagine everyone would be interested to hear them. I would.

Juozas, could you direct me in disassembly and reassembly safely? I am curious too and would like to open it to clean it before twisting it much more even to examine it. Can you post mechanism pictures? I thought I could imagine the insides pretty well - a six spindle design simply without the core split in two. However, twice people have said they believe is more closely related to the groove mechanism. If anyone can show a picture of the regular groove mechanism, I would appreciate that too, although I think I can imagine it generally - the spindle gone, and pieces interlocking. Jin and Aleksey, and all, I will let you know if I do open it.

Jin, I was guessing the same anchoring of the mechanism to one part that you mentioned and guessing it to be one of the two non-edge cubes. You should definitely go on building your design, in my opinion. It could just as likely take you in new directions as old.

Have other people seen dominos with metal parts in them that show at the end of spindles? (Again, I have never opened one myself.) Their being there is one thing that made me guess this might be a prototype. Another is the excessively large openings to the core, as the pictures show - together they look like they are like that to allow for fiddling, including tightening, to adjust dimensions of the spindle and mechanism tensions.

Thanks for sharing the hope it might of been a prototype, Sandy, and anyone else that got excited about it in that light with me. I'll be glad to contribute pictures to TwistyPuzzles.com.

I'm still not clear on the variations on the main domino line. For instance, were spindle mechanisms and tab-and-groove mechanisms produced simultaneously when the domino was released, or was one produced during one release, one during another? And were the raised pip versions made with both types of mechanisms?


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sun Dec 14, 2003 7:56 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 16, 1999 9:31 am
Location: Kaunas, Lithuania
I have the Domino from the same producer. It was made in Ukraine after Hungarian Domino. Main production of the facility was for the Soviet army. But those military producers had to make something for consumers as well. They were capable and chosed Rubik's Domino.
I have disasembled the puzzle once. It is based on groove mechanism. Plastic parts are extremely well made. But relatively long spider arms can't resist to some bending force, which is unavoidable while twisting. So, sometimes it is hard to turn. Anyway, you have interesting and rare puzzle.


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Mon Dec 15, 2003 5:19 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 2:19 pm
Location: Yaroslavl, Russia and Maryland, USA
There are Domino versions that were produced in other cities of the former Soviet Union. I don't own one, and I have no idea if they have the same mechanism and the one pictured. Some people on this forum who own one may shed some light on this.

Anyway, can someone describe this mechanism in detail, or show us the disassembled puzzle?

Also, it's probably little known that there was russian version on Nintendo barrel. I have one. It's identical to the original barrel with the only obvious difference in the color of the parts that are regularly black. In my version produced in Soviet Union these top and bottom parts are soft green.


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 8:25 pm 
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Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
The groove version (in a litte blue box) appeared first and produce by Politechinca, this type was discontinued because it was unstable. Politechinca was renamed to Politoys and produced the spindle version in a plastic dome.

See more pictures and info on my site

Ton


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 1:16 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 16, 1999 9:31 am
Location: Kaunas, Lithuania
How to dissasemble Domino?
You can unscrew the bolt (gap between layers is just enough), which keeps cylindrical white plastic piece attached to the spindle. I had no problems assembling it.


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 2:43 am 
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Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 2:15 am
Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
The groove version has on the black a center cap that you can remove. The spindle you can remove the white center cap. This is where the screw is.
Ton


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 4:56 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 2:19 pm
Location: Yaroslavl, Russia and Maryland, USA
In my groove version Domino the center cap is on the white center.


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 4:56 am 
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Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2003 10:21 am
Location: Orlando, Florida
another mechanism for a 2x3x3 that I just thought up would be from a 4x4x4. First connect the pieces together to get an unproportioned 2x3x3, then use other 4x4x4 cubies to extend the pieces to create equal size cubes. This would involve 152 cubies and would be very large. This is could also be done by extending a 4x4x4 into a 6x6x6, then bonding pieces together. Its a very simple idea, and chances are that no one will do it anyways.

Jeff


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Fri Jan 02, 2004 6:42 am 
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Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2003 5:09 pm
Thank you all for you posts on this topic.

This twisty domino has been added to the Twisty Puzzles site under "Domino (Indented Pips)" in the "N-Sided Puzzles: Six section".

(http://twistypuzzles.com/cgi-bin/fs.cgi ... i?pid=1243)


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 Post subject: Re: Twisty Domino
PostPosted: Sat Jan 03, 2004 6:42 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 2:19 pm
Location: Yaroslavl, Russia and Maryland, USA
Louis, the design of this (russian?) Domino puzzle looks
very similar to the various mechanism designs described
in this old russian patent from my patents collection:

http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?sf=n&FI ... =SU1505561

While the patent does not have the mechanism for the Domino,
I do think the designs it features look very much alike to
the internal shapes of pieces of this Domino puzzles. What
do you guys think?


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