Online since 2002. Over 3300 puzzles, 2600 worldwide members, and 270,000 messages.

TwistyPuzzles.com Forum

It is currently Wed Jul 23, 2014 5:43 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 27 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:36 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2008 1:47 am
Location: near Utrecht, Netherlands
Recently, there has been an explosion in people designing and printing new puzzles. A by-product of designing and printing puzzles is designs that don't end up being printed.
Many people show off their puzzle designing by-products, posting a CAD drawing or two but never actually end up printing that design. I think it is a bad practise to show off puzzles that you're not going to make.

There are a few ways in which posts with puzzle renders can be interpreted:
1) Works in progress
2) Concept publications (here's my puzzle idea, you can do with it whatever you want)
3) The "vague" category


Option 1 seems okay so long as you're going to make the puzzle within a reasonable time frame. A bit like Oskar posts his designs on his Shapeways' shop before making them.

Option 3 is what I have a problem with. It is option 1, but without the "progress" bit. With this, I mean people who post partially finished CAD drawings. While it is nice to show your off your work/CAD skills, I think it is harmful to the community.
To me, a CAD drawing post is a clear signal not to make a puzzle. I might get slack for stealing the idea, or get beaten to making the puzzle. To me, these are reasonable reasons for steering away from a design.
The problem is, many of these CAD drawings are never made in to puzzles by the authors. However, they don't get made in to puzzles by other designers either, who otherwise might have come up with the design on their own. In any case, the end result is: no puzzle.

Option 2 is good. You could argue designers don't like making public domain puzzles (since they can't claim any rights) but I think that's a very far stretch. I bet far more puzzles will be made by designers picking up public domain puzzles than avoiding them.


I think people should stop making category 3 posts. I think that if they still want to post, they should either make it clear that they're making the design public domain, or design fewer puzzles so they can actually produce some of them and only show those that will be made.
There are many puzzles that are already public domain (like cuboids) but people should still explicitly state they're not going to make them. It is still a deterrent from making a puzzle even if someone just hints they might be doing the same.


Of course, everything I've said mostly applies to designs that are low on the creativity scale. For more creative designs, it might be acceptable to make a post saying "this is my idea and I'm willing to license it".

Frankly, some people are dumping out their entire unfinished puzzle work flow. Imagine if I dumped out my entire designing folder essentially saying "these puzzles are now only for me". That just doesn't work. It encourages people just posting as many designs as possible just to get the rights to them. I think you want to encourage people to make puzzles, not just design them.

How do other people feel about this? I know it is a dangerous thing to discourage people from sharing their ideas, but it is really annoying to be thinking about making a puzzle, then being thrown off it by some designer posting their drawing of it.
Am I just a pompous git spoiled by the ability to print whatever my heart desires, wanting to kill off any beginning designers by making a ridiculous rant or do I have a valid point?

_________________
Tom's Shapeways Puzzle Shop - your order from my shop includes free stickers!
Tom's Puzzle Website


Buy my mass produced puzzles at Mefferts:
- 4x4x6 Cuboid for just $38
- Curvy Copter for just $18
- 3x4x5 Cuboid for just $34


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:43 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2008 8:57 pm
I too find it all the more annoying when people suddenly show off a design with no more than saying something like "hey guys I made this"

It really kills my drive for trying new designs, since I then figure 'Well, that's another one that's been done'. In my perfect universe It would be awesome if people only posted designs for puzzles they have prototyped, and proven to work.

Great post Tom!

_________________
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:50 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
Tom, I agree with you entirely: either people should post a design only if they are seriously working on getting it made (and ideally only after it is actually made), or they should make it clear that it's "open source", in which case anybody can use the idea and suggest improvements. It is not acceptable for someone to release a design and expect that nobody else should use it.

In any case, nobody can expect to publish and then keep their designs for themselves unless they first get a patent, because not everyone who reads this forum is a member who has agreed to some higher standard of ethics.

_________________
If you want something you’ve never had, you’ve got to do something you’ve never done - Thomas Jefferson


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:57 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:31 am
Location: Greece, Australia, Thailand, India, Singapore.
Totally agree with all of you guys.

I admit, it has become slightly annoying. Anyone can come forward,
post a ton of designs, and then claim them. That is not right in the sense
that someone else may be in the process of finishing and presenting it!
(while the first person only made some drawings with no solid proof
of concept, or even mechanism!).

The genuine quality builders are discouraged. That said, I am sure
those who post the CAD drawings could become excellent builders,
but until the prove themselves they should be more careful.

And to add to this, some people should also ensure they are not
using mechanisms or themes which are already IP protected.
(this also has been happening in many cases lately - sorry to sound
unpleasant, but it is not fair to the inventors who had invested in them).

Simply put, Option 3 is not a good etiquette.

:)


Pantazis

_________________

Educational R&D, Gravity, 4D Symmetry, Puzzle Ninja, Matrix Mech, Alien Technology.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 3:40 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:07 am
Location: Germany, Bavaria
Just to add my view as a non-builder / non-designer: I agree with all of this!

_________________
My collection at: http://sites.google.com/site/twistykon/home


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 5:27 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 27, 2007 3:50 pm
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark
I agree totally! Although I think its exciting to look at new designs, its FAR from looking at a finished or even work-in-progress prototype. So far that I'd rather be without!
But I cant hold back making clear if I like a design, because I hope it will encourage the designer to make it.
I know its a rather weak statement, because the designer should know for him/herself wether its worthy or not

_________________
Tony Fisher wrote:
I believe it would work best with black plastic.

My puzzles in the Museum
My Website
My Youtube Channel


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 6:35 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Apr 16, 2000 3:17 pm
Location: Hong Kong
I told Dave at IPP that I hated this section of the forum. And it is just for this reason. There is nothing worse to me than finding an unread post and then realizing it is nothing more than a computer rendering of something that isn't being made.

I think it's great that you guys are trying new ideas, but outside designs with no mechanism or proof of concept, I believe, is a waste of time.

_________________
Rox's Rambling Blog
Katsmom's Puzzling Videos


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 7:47 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:57 pm
Location: Pittsburgh
katsmom wrote:
I think it's great that you guys are trying new ideas, but outside designs with no mechanism or proof of concept, I believe, is a waste of time.
Definitely. I mean, anyone can open up a CAD program, make a cube, and draw lines on the surface. "Hey guys look a super mega elite skewb no one else can make it!" but it's not even cut through.

_________________
3x3x3 PB: 00:48.10
"Study gravitation, it's a field with a lot of potential."
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 7:52 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 9:21 am
Location: Massachusetts, USA
Tom, thanks for making this post. I, too, have really been getting annoyed by people who are continuously posting their unfinished designs, and I was hoping that someone would make a post like this. I agree with you completely.

_________________
Katniss wrote:
Only on this forum would people use a V-cube 7 as a size comparison for a cat :lol:

My Shapeways shop


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:45 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 09, 2002 2:19 pm
Location: Yaroslavl, Russia and Maryland, USA
I am annoyed by these posts as well. Those posts would serve better if they were discussions of the mechanisms.

Ironically the way I see it is that those posts look very much like claims for patents in the real world. Lots of times one would receive a patent and takes his time to make the actual product (puzzle). Or never make it at all. We can all provide may examples of that. So why are we supporting such patents and deny our members their chance to do the same and claim their inventions? I am sorry if this sounds provocative, but I just wanted to raise the issue.

_________________
Aleksey


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:56 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2008 9:17 pm
this is basically why I stopped posting in my topic.

_________________
Purchase our custom built puzzles at:
MyPuzzleStop.com


Clay: Barrel cube?...Why? It's such a Geometrical contradiction...I don't understand[/size]
Eva:?


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 12:04 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 7:03 am
Location: Koblenz, Germany
In general: I have to agree.
In special: There is one specific design I would really like to see in real life but the chances are rather low as I now realize.


Last edited by Andreas Nortmann on Mon Aug 16, 2010 12:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 12:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2005 1:45 pm
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
Along these same lines, something else that is annoying is when a designer does post a pic or vid of a finished product and someone comes along and says "I thought of this exact same thing last week, but I didn't make it yet." This happens CONSTANTLY! Seriously - don't spoil the builder's new puzzle thread by trying to take some of the credit when you didn't even lift a finger!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 12:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2008 4:37 pm
Location: Canada
TomZ wrote:
...Am I just a pompous git spoiled by the ability to print whatever my heart desires, wanting to kill off any beginning designers by making a ridiculous rant or do I have a valid point?

You have a valid point!
I never show, or even hint at, my designs before I release them. I want to have a solid version first. For this reason, I haven't produced any, because I have little money, and have to save up for each puzzle.
And even though you are "spoiled by the ability to print whatever your heart desires" I completely agree! :lol:

I think-
If it's been done before- go ahead and show it off, just to show your progress in design.
If it's new and absolutely amazing- Why not wait until you print it? It's unlikely that someone else will do it before you, and if they do, then we'll have two completely independent designers making the same amazing puzzle! That's incredible for both of them! However, if you post a CAD drawing and say the design is yours, then what do they do? They don't have a chance to make a new puzzle anymore, and if you don't even get around to making it... it never exists.
If it's new, but not super creative- Someone else might print it, the idea has probably been thought up by many others... again, why not just wait unntil you can print it?

merlintocs wrote:
Along these same lines, something else that is annoying is when a designer does post a pic or vid of a finished product and someone comes along and says "I thought of this exact same thing last week, but I didn't make it yet." This happens CONSTANTLY! Seriously - don't spoil the builder's new puzzle thread by trying to take some of the credit when you didn't even lift a finger!


And if that happens, and you were planning on actually printing it, why not just PM them and tell them that you have your own design that you were going to print, and see if it's alright with them? Most designers will understand, and it will never be exactly the same!

_________________


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 2:13 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
Aleksey wrote:
So why are we supporting such patents ...
Because that's the law, so we have to.
Aleksey wrote:
... and deny our members their chance to do the same and claim their inventions?
Because showing a design that's never made should not provide the same level of protection as a patent, which is granted on the basis that it provides enough information to make the actual product and can be revoked if sufficient efforts are not made to do so.

merlintocs wrote:
Along these same lines, something else that is annoying is when ... someone comes along and says "I thought of this exact same thing last week, but I didn't make it yet."
Hey, I just had that exact same thought. :lol:

BTW, I hope I didn't put anyone off the challenge of making a triple fused void petaminx by mentioning the concept. But just in case I DID put you off, let me clarify that this idea is "open source" as I have no intention of making this myself. So now you have no excuse. :wink:

_________________
If you want something you’ve never had, you’ve got to do something you’ve never done - Thomas Jefferson


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 3:49 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2008 2:39 pm
Location: Marquette, MI, USA
I would like to apologize for my recent posts. I in no way intended to offend or discourage anyone. I for one love the design of puzzle. I enjoy how the fit together and work more than actually solving the puzzle or anything else. I have showed many of my designs because I don't want to or plan to make any of them because I simply enjoyed doing the computer work to see them. Because I feel this way I thought that others may enjoy being able to see the puzzle even if it isn't in physical form. I have only shown these designs, any design that I plan to make, even if it is not in the near future I have kept to myself. I will stop posting designs in respect to other forum members and I hope you will accept my apology.

I also agree with merlintocs. Nothing is more annoying than seeing someones beautiful creation then seeing someone post something like that. I am also sure that many people wouldn't even mind if someone made the same puzzle separately even if it was after it was made, such as the Face turning Icosahedrons. but there is no need to cry about someone making a puzzle before you.

merlintocs wrote:
Along these same lines, something else that is annoying is when a designer does post a pic or vid of a finished product and someone comes along and says "I thought of this exact same thing last week, but I didn't make it yet." This happens CONSTANTLY! Seriously - don't spoil the builder's new puzzle thread by trying to take some of the credit when you didn't even lift a finger!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 4:53 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2007 3:11 am
Location: Oregon, USA
Frankly, I would prefer if the forum tried to be tolerate abstract CAD posts and put them into perspective. Those ideas are floating around, so it's consistent with a "forum" philosophy to permit users to share them. Some CAD renders are little more than digital versions of the old paper mockups à la Mèffert 1982 so we shouldn't allow someone to "claim" unwarranted ownership based on an abstract sketch.

In the "forum" spirit, expect members contribute abstract ideas. Also in the "forum" spirit, gently remind them if necessary that they're giving away anything they disclose.

merlintocs wrote:
Along these same lines, something else that is annoying is when a designer does post a pic or vid of a finished product and someone comes along and says "I thought of this exact same thing last week, but I didn't make it yet." This happens CONSTANTLY! Seriously - don't spoil the builder's new puzzle thread by trying to take some of the credit when you didn't even lift a finger!

It's inevitable some people might be thinking along the same lines. A designer needn't feel threatened if someone discloses parallel ideas, particularly if it's a good-faith effort to promote puzzle development.

When Kelvin discribed his maze container in the Qubami thread, I wasn't trying to "take some of the credit" when I disclosed a similar idea I was working on. As a whole, the Qubami thread has been a perfect illustration of the "forum" philosophy working at its best: users have contributed ideas and Kelvin has retained his freedom to accept, debate, or decline those ideas--never worrying about taking (or losing) credit for his work.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 5:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 1:00 am
Location: Colorado
The reason I recently started my designs thread was because I do not have the ability to make all of them. My designs that are not my favorites, I post in the hope that it might inspire other designers.

_________________
My Shapeways Shop
My YouTube Videos
My Museum Puzzles


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:31 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 21, 2006 5:32 pm
Location: Bay Area, CA
I will concur that there has been a surplus of claims based on designs that are not followed up with actual functioning physical puzzles.

I am lucky enough to live in an area near a few great designers and so I have a good perspective on the work it often takes to transform a good concept into a final product. Posting about the idea or design before that point can be interesting, but often premature.

I like the sharing of designs but with so many people working in CAD now we do need to consider the issues of stepping on each other's toes. If you are working on a project and want to share it before it is complete try to consider these issues:
1.) Do you intend to take the puzzle to completion?
2.) Will your post discourage others from pursuing that territory?
3.) Do you wish to claim credit or protect that puzzle as your design?

Weighing these issues is a courtesy to your peers. How you answer these may help guide when and how you choose to share your work. For many perhaps just making it clear your intent will help others know how their own plans are affected by your work.

As for multiple people working on the same design I am not overly concerned about races. Of course there is some pride in being first but for most of us I hope the pride in accomplishing your own design is the main motivator.

Dave

_________________
Image
LitwinPuzzles.com has info on my puzzles.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:05 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 06, 2008 9:42 pm
Location: A Coruña - Spain
I've never been very long words in this forum (the little knowledge of the language helps this), but today I need to say a few things, I hope you can understand without misinterpretation.

I too had noticed the large number of designs that were being published, all done in CAD, and for a few days had in my head the idea of opening a thread to ask about the motives and intentions of these publications. I did not understand if the authors wanted to gain some kind of law on these designs or just make them free for the whole community. Finally decided not to open that thread, but I see someone has done, and my opinion, very personal, it makes no sense if it is not going to do the puzzle.

I also use CAD, once I put an image on the CAD, but most of the time simply to use checks desert before cutting a puzzle where I should not ... Also I have some designs made entirely in CAD, normally I do it when the construction of the puzzle at hand is almost impossible or when I need to do some master for molds.

As the famous phrase "I Thought of this exact same thing last week, but i did not make it yet", well, I've seen so many times that I do not realize whether or not. If you have an idea, work on it, if someone else is doing the same as you, do not worry, look for the pleasure of completing their work. I do not understand the fascination that some have to be the first to do something, for me the important thing is to finish what you do and feel comfortable with it.

As I said, I hope you can understand well.

A greeting.

_________________
Image Image Image Image Image


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:36 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:11 am
Location: Marin, CA
We as a community have a convention (not a legal requirement!) that if somebody makes something first then everybody else stays off of it and doesn't build it. What we have here is an issue of how far along someone should have to go to prove something to be able to claim that it's theirs. Clearly the ease of sketching something in CAD makes setting the bar at a drawing too low, because that's only a small fraction of the work necessary to build the concept.

People are welcome to post about their ideas all they want, but we should probably have the convention that all ideas are considered completely unproven and up for grabs until an actual prototype is made, and even then it might have to be a 'reasonably functional' prototype. There are plenty of puzzles I've worked on where the road from the first sucky prototype to the final working one was a long and winding one.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 2:59 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
Bram wrote:
Clearly the ease of sketching something in CAD makes setting the bar at a drawing too low, because that's only a small fraction of the work necessary to build the concept.

People are welcome to post about their ideas all they want, but we should probably have the convention that all ideas are considered completely unproven and up for grabs until an actual prototype is made, and even then it might have to be a 'reasonably functional' prototype. There are plenty of puzzles I've worked on where the road from the first sucky prototype to the final working one was a long and winding one.

Agreed. As explained by one of the most prolific inventors of all time:
Thomas Edison wrote:
Genius is one percent inspiration, ninety-nine percent perspiration

In other words, an idea (CAD drawing) is worth about 1% of the effort required to make the idea work.

_________________
If you want something you’ve never had, you’ve got to do something you’ve never done - Thomas Jefferson


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 7:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 1:00 am
Location: Colorado
Thomas Edison does not deserve most of the credit he is givin* but I agree with your opinion about the work needed to turn a design into a prototype and a prototype into a final version.

Every day for the past six years I have worked on a non puzzle related invention. The first working prototype didn't exist until three years ago. The current version is still of such a low quality that without knowing what to look for, it is 100% unimpressive.

Anyone that is willing to spend that much time creating something deserves the credit for it. With puzzles, some credit should be givin to the first person to have the idea/design but the physical puzzle should be considered the builders.

*Today we don't use his electricity or lights, we use Nikola Tesla's. Film was not created by Edison. It was created by his worker who was fired after inventing it.

_________________
My Shapeways Shop
My YouTube Videos
My Museum Puzzles


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:06 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:21 pm
Location: Marin, CA
Great post, Tom.

I've been thinking this for awhile, but I didn't want to seem a downer by saying it.

The truth is, the ideas and the level of CAD shown are usually literally 1-5% of the work required to get to a working video.

I hope Oskar won't mind me quoting him, and I hope I have the percentage right, when he said, after completing a working CAD design for a puzzle, "Well, now for the other 95 percent of the work." He was speaking of clearances, fillets, assembly, caps, and on and on, through the first failed prototype, to a final working video.

I agree with the other posters that it removes a bit of the fun of going all the way to a working prototype. There are times when a CAD snapshot can add to a discussion, but in general, they aren't puzzle announcements to me.

_________________
Jason Smith posted here as 'io' through 2012.
Visit Jason Smith's PuzzleForge on Shapeways!
Jason Smith's Puzzles - YouTube Channel.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:03 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2009 1:03 pm
Here are my two cents.

1) People and companies who apply for patents opportunistically with no intention to manufacture are called "patent trol". However, the term "Twisty Puzzle Troll" would not be appropriate, as it is mostly not opportunism but financial limitations that prevent the designer to build a prototype, even though 3D-printing has gotten very affordable nowadays.

2) My Shapeways Shop has a "Sponsor Project" section. These are designs that I do not want to prototype myself as they are too expensive and/or risky. So far I have found (and disappointed) two sponsors. There are three additional projects still looking for a sponsor. Interested? :D

So twisty puzzle designer, if you design and publish a new puzzle, then have the courtesy to make it at least available on Shapeways for someone else to buy/sponsor.

Thank you.

Oskar

_________________
Oskar's home page, YouTube, Shapeways Shop, Puzzlemaster, and fan club
Image.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 8:50 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 23, 2005 1:45 pm
Location: St. Louis, Missouri
Jorbs3210 wrote:
Awww MANNNNN! :evil: :evil: :evil: I had this idea first! Well, you won it fair and square. :( It looks great!


The above was posted in Drewseph's Quad-X thread. This is exactly what I'm talking about.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Publicizing puzzle designs
PostPosted: Sun Sep 12, 2010 1:16 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 12:09 pm
Location: Missouri
Just got pointed to this thread so sorry for the bump.

I suspect I'm one of the offenders here. So I felt I should offer my 2 cents...

Bram wrote:
We as a community have a convention (not a legal requirement!) that if somebody makes something first then everybody else stays off of it and doesn't build it. What we have here is an issue of how far along someone should have to go to prove something to be able to claim that it's theirs. Clearly the ease of sketching something in CAD makes setting the bar at a drawing too low, because that's only a small fraction of the work necessary to build the concept.

Agreed... and my take as well. I've built nothing and I've thrown out ideas and pictures that anyone is free to jump on. The two ideas I hope to be able to make and offer at my shapeways shop at the moment are the Mixup Circle Cube and the Mixup Master Skewb. I've got some help at the moment turning my POV-Ray model of the Mixup Circle Cube into something I can submit to Shapeways and the Mixup Master Skewb is an idea that just hit me last night. The design is solid in my head but I have yet to put it in POV-Ray or on paper but conceptually is a much easier design then the Mixup Circle Cube.

But the ideas were posted to the web by me and they have been released to the public. If someone makes them / sells them / etc. I'd appreciate some credit but I'm owed nothing. If I manage to get these on Shapeways then yes I'll claim them as mine but its more important that they get build (by anyone) then me getting credit or claim. If I wasn't willing to risk losing that I wouldn't have posted what I have. I'm just very short on cash at the moment and the only 3D modeling software I have experience with is POV-Ray and Shapeway doesn't accept POV-Ray files.

Bram wrote:
People are welcome to post about their ideas all they want, but we should probably have the convention that all ideas are considered completely unproven and up for grabs until an actual prototype is made, and even then it might have to be a 'reasonably functional' prototype. There are plenty of puzzles I've worked on where the road from the first sucky prototype to the final working one was a long and winding one.

This is my stance as well.

Oskar wrote:
So twisty puzzle designer, if you design and publish a new puzzle, then have the courtesy to make it at least available on Shapeways for someone else to buy/sponsor.

I want to... I really do. I'd seen post here on this topic in the past but who here is willing to help make CAD models I can submit to Shapeways? I have almost zero time these days and I'm short on funds but I will pay for this service if the price is reasonable. I want to take part in the joy of being able to offer something new to the world and my objective isn't to get rich doing so. Maybe enough to pay for someone's CAD services would be nice but even that isn't my expectation.

Carl

_________________
-
Image

Image


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 27 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 8 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

Forum powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group