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 Post subject: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:33 pm 
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has anyone had any experience with this plastic?

Smooth Cast ONYX


b/c i just dont like working with alumilite

thanks,
-Clay

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:42 pm 
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I haven't seen this before. I'm going to stop @ Smooth-On tomorrow (hopefully)and get some of this!!! Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:03 pm 
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Calzone wrote:
I haven't seen this before. I'm going to stop @ Smooth-On tomorrow (hopefully)and get some of this!!! Thanks!


Can you let us know how it goes if you do pick up some. I would be interested to see if there is much of a difference between Alumilite and ONYX. I am not a huge fan of Alumilite either.

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:21 pm 
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everyone

i just called the smooth on distributor in orlando FL

smooth cast onyx in a very new product
and they said they wont have for another two weeks
and that they are very excited!!! as am i

so just a heads up ill probably be purchasing as soon as it is released!

-Clay

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 2:22 pm 
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sounds cool, I may actually be able to offer 2 colors of puzzles then!

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2009 6:06 pm 
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Ok.... I went to Smooth-On this afternoon. They do not have the Onyx in the warehouse yet. It's that new!! I've gotten to know a couple of the girls there. They are going to put some aside and call me next week when it arrives. It should be around Wednesday / Thursday.

Of course I had to ask the warehouse guys if there was any hanging around yet..... no luck! :(

All I got today was more SmoothCast300 and a brochure for the Onyx.....which REALLY makes me want to get this stuff!! :D


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 1:46 pm 
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I can't wait to see how this stuff performs. It looks excellent!

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 1:51 pm 
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you'll get more resin for the money if you use alimulate black instead

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 3:53 pm 
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olz wrote:
you'll get more resin for the money if you use alimulate black instead



Alumilite


Smoothcast Onyx

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 3:55 pm 
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Clay n Eva Creations wrote:
olz wrote:
you'll get more resin for the money if you use alimulate black instead



Alumilite


Smoothcast Onyx

alimulate = 2 gallons
ONYX = 1 gallon

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 3:57 pm 
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I thought that was only for the rubber. My gallon kit of resin looks like 1 gallon each.

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 4:15 pm 
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they are both one gallon per part

part a is 1 gallon

part be is also 1 gallon

alumilite is just phrasing differently

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:55 pm 
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I got a call from Smooth-On on Thursday. They told me that part B was mixed, packed and ready, but part A was not. More than likely it will be ready around Tuesday.

Also.....it is one gallon of EACH (part A and part B).


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Aug 29, 2009 8:12 pm 
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Calzone wrote:
I got a call from Smooth-On on Thursday. They told me that part B was mixed, packed and ready, but part A was not. More than likely it will be ready around Tuesday.

Also.....it is one gallon of EACH (part A and part B).



thank you..lol

-Clay

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:10 pm 
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I got the Onyx! I'll be trying it out tonight (if sober enough) and posting a review shortly thereafter.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:35 pm 
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Calzone wrote:
I got the Onyx! I'll be trying it out tonight (if sober enough) and posting a review shortly thereafter.




haha
bud light?
or brown liquor? jk

i cant wait!

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:48 pm 
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I am excited to see how well it works as i plan to cast some Terahedrons with it.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 2:54 am 
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Clay n Eva Creations wrote:
haha - bud light?or brown liquor? jk
Neither... I'm a big fan of Ketel One!

Anyway..... I just made this black Twist Cube with the Onyx.
Here's how I compare it to Alumilite's black resin:
1) just as messy :lol:
2) Onyx has a deeper, richer color. It looks identical to black 3x3 DIYs. The flat center cap is from a DIY kit.
3) Onyx looks just about as bad as Alumilite black when you sand it, but it cleans up really well. I took the Dremel with a polishing wheel to it, and I looks NICE! I left the face of one corner unpolished as you can see in the pic.
4) Onyx takes a little longer to start setting up.....longer than Alumilite black but slightly quicker than SmoothCast 300.
5) Onyx cost me $90 vs. Alumilite's $116
Overall.... I like it and plan to keep using it.
Attachment:
BlackTwist.jpg
BlackTwist.jpg [ 802.07 KiB | Viewed 5676 times ]


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 11:03 am 
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NICE, thanks so much Calzone for showing us this. It is not available in Canada for another 2-3 weeks so I am happy I asked my Smooth-On supplier to hang on to some for me. I can't wait to try it out.
Calzone, what type of polishing wheel do you use?

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 12:58 pm 
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Calzone wrote:
Here's how I compare it to Alumilite's black resin...
What can you tell us about its viscosity? Alumilite is much thicker than SmoothCast 300. This can be good in some ways and bad in others:
1.) Good for pouring without leaking down the side of the cup as much
2.) Good for holding to a mold top half sooner (on some molds I don't use Drew's method entirely and rely on some to stick in a shallow mold top with no waiting)
3.) Bad for air bubbles in small areas
4.) etc.

So I like Alumilte for some molds but SmoothCast for others. If Onyx is thin like it's pale brother that will mean I can choose between two black resins depending on what viscosity I want.

What's your experience?

Dave

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2009 1:29 pm 
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Apollo wrote:
Calzone, what type of polishing wheel do you use?

I use the little ones that attach to a mandrel....
Image

@ Dave - Both parts A and B have a different viscosity than Alumilite. Alumilite's mixed viscosity is 190 cps. versus Onyx's 100.

In response to the rest of your questions.....
1) It leaks down the side of the cup like anything else I've ever worked with. I just pour quickly or rotate my cup as usual.
2) It does need to set up a little before you can flip your mold. Alumilite's thicker formula may be better suited for that approach.
3) I haven't poured any small or pointy pieces yet, so I can't say much about that. However, there were no visible air bubbles when I poured the pieces for the puzzle above. I plan to use the Onyx again today. I'll try some smaller pieces to see how it goes.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 8:57 pm 
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just a little update
IMO onyx is probably the worst resin
i have ever used


the flash is nearly invincible.
and when you finally sand it down to be level
with the side of the piece you find small voids
in the piece.(we are pretty good at casting so we know how to avoid
bubbles and streched pieces). also it is very oily
( i can feel my fingers slipping of the keys when i type)

it has just caused so much trouble and a slow down in
my puzzle building...

for those of you wanting good black resin
go with alumilite i am fully confident in this
as a first choice..

although if your looking for something cheap...
then go with onyx..(you get what you pay for)

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:04 pm 
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Did you contact smooth-on?, maybe you got a bad batch.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:15 pm 
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well all in all

what i should have said
was that ONYX doesnt suit my building style

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:18 pm 
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Clay n Eva Creations wrote:
the flash is nearly invincible.
and when you finally sand it down to be level
with the side of the piece you find small voids
in the piece.

zevipa wrote:
Did you contact smooth-on?, maybe you got a bad batch.

Well, I've had pretty much the same experience with Onyx, I guess, except that I just started, so I had nothing to compare it against, and figured that casting was just hard!

Clay, I thought you'd been using it for a while... what have you been using for your 2x2x5s?


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 01, 2009 9:25 pm 
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ive been using alumilite black


also dont blame it ALL on the resin. :D
casting can be very difficult at the beginning
atleast until you get used to it.

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Mon Nov 02, 2009 10:08 am 
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I just got the 1 gallon deal from some website. I was really exited because its my first black resin. I payed so much money for it because shipping for 8,5 Kg.

now after reading your comments I feel I should have never gotten that stuff.

Is it really that bad?

and what do you mean by invincible flash? Is the plastic stronger and more flexible than other? Have you tried using an exacto knife?

Does pieces actually come out worse?

I presume you use drew's casting technic.
What is the problems with it?

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 10:03 am 
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Ok I am really thinking about this. :cry:

would you recommend me to cancel my order. And get alumilite instead??

Will you ever use the rest of your Onyx resin?

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:21 am 
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Doubleyou wrote:
Is it really that bad?
No, there's just more work involved.

Doubleyou wrote:
and what do you mean by invincible flash?

This particular resin cures REALLY hard and somewhat brittle. Even really thin layers of flash can be a pain in the ass. Cleaning up the pieces is a little more tedious as compared to Alumilite Black in that regard. I try to get the razor to them as soon as they come out of the mold.

White resin is much more forgiving when it comes to cleaning up pieces. Black resin (Onyx or Alumilite) shows every little mark from the razor/sandpaper/file. You end up having to sand down to a really fine grit then polish it or paint it. I don't paint my puzzles, so I end up polishing this stuff.....which takes way too long.....and why I don't care for black resin!


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 11:30 am 
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Another thing I noticed is that I had to wait > 10 minutes for demolding with Onyx, but in Drew's videos he says "wait 5 minutes"...

Does Alumilite cure faster?


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 12:47 pm 
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Yes, Onyx takes longer to cure. That is one of the reasons I like it. It gives me a little more time to pour multiple molds.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 1:16 pm 
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Multiple molds... OK, maybe you can explain something I struggled with. You're suggesting multiple molds from one resin mix. The only way I found to get usable pieces was to actually use two batches of resin for one mold: first, mix a small amount, and pour the top half, wait 5-10 seconds, mix a larger batch, pour the bottom half, wait just a bit longer, then put the top half on the bottom half. That way, the top has solidified just enough not to drain out any during the flip, but the bottom is still liquid enough to easily conform to the surface on the top half.

I failed at least 15 times to get a successful pour before I realized this is what I had to do. It looks from Drew's youtube casting tutorial like this is what he does too, but the resin is mixed offscreen, so I'm not sure.

But if you get multiple molds from one mix... how do you not have the problems I had?


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 2:17 pm 
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I pour just about the same way as you do. I just tend to pour 5 - 6 mold 'tops' at a time. Onyx gives me the time to pour into each one carefully and not have to rush as much as I would with Alumilite.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 2:48 pm 
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OK, thanks, that makes sense. Glad to get a sanity check.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 03, 2009 6:15 pm 
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hello everyone

i wanted to apologize for being a little dramatic
i was very frustrated and i should not have taken
my anger out in front of everyone

ONYZ can be a great resin but it just doesnt suit my
building style..

@doubleyou, you did not waste you money
also you dont have anything to compare it to
and the longer working time could be good for you
if this is your first time casting..

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 8:50 am 
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thanks guys for chilling me out! I am pretty glad I got this resin now!
If anyone prefers it, then it cant be bad.

I was really getting pissed at myself for not waiting longer with the order.

I have some experience with resin, but only the sand-colored stuff (not even real white). I handmade masters and copied those. I have no experience with FDM pieces yet.

I cant wait to get some projects started up. In fact I have some really cool puzzles planned out with ... wait for it... Olz!

Now my only bigger setback is that I "expected" to get highres pieces printed. Now I find that was not possible at this time, and decided to go with FDM at PrintTo3d.

If anyone can direct me towards a place online where I can get high res pieces printed, please let me know!

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2009 4:17 pm 
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Put the money you'd spend on hi-res masters into more casting resin. I got the FDM-printed 1x2x3 cube from printo3d and smoothed as recommended. The pieces still fit accurately after smoothing, and the cast pieces fit together (after learning how to get rid of air bubbles in the mold) just fine.


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 5:55 pm 
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Apparently the Onyx takes a while to cure. I sent out the first batch of puzzles that I made with this stuff about a month ago. Last week I received an irate email telling me that the stickers looked like garbage and that I should be ashamed of myself, etc. I was more than surprised and a little pissed off too!

I told her to return the puzzle to me. When I opened the box, I could immediately see what she was talking about.

These pieces had been poured 8 and 9 days prior to me applying the stickers!! I applied the sticker a day before shipping and they looked fine when I packed it up the next day.

If this has happened to anyone else that received a black puzzle, please let me know right away! I will either send you replacement stickers or resticker it for you. I apologize if this is the case.

Attachment:
Axis(OnyxResin) 002.jpg
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Attachment:
Axis(OnyxResin) 005.jpg
Axis(OnyxResin) 005.jpg [ 686.8 KiB | Viewed 5659 times ]

Attachment:
Axis(OnyxResin) 007.jpg
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Attachment:
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Axis(OnyxResin) 008.jpg [ 619.77 KiB | Viewed 5659 times ]


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Fri Nov 27, 2009 6:38 pm 
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@David

we had the same problem but we figured it out.
you have to sand the hell out of faces until they turn to a medium grey.
unfortunately this defeats the purpose of having black resin, but i still looks
like black when contrasting with the stickers, i mean, no one buys a puzzle
from you just to have it unstickered right? this should prevent this from happening again. also just to be sure, when i finish a customers puzzle, i sticker it and wait
at least 1-2 days before shipping to make sure that they dont bubble.

hope this helped,


P.S, "you should be ashamed of your self"??? ...that was out of context and very
unprofessional, i mean, it is a CUSTOM puzzle which are never PERFECT..ish..lol

-Clay

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Fri Dec 04, 2009 5:38 pm 
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I don't know, that sounds about like Alumilite: It just takes a *long* time to cure, and different pieces will cure at different speeds.

These days I wait two months after castign before stickering. It's painful, but less so than bubbled stickers. Patience and a shiny black puzzle is better than a grey puzzle that may bubble anyway :)

Dave

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 2:22 am 
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Little bit of a funny story today that pertains to Onyx.

Mom: "Hey I lost a onyx stone for my ring and there is supposed to be two, but no there is one. Can you make a fake piece by casting"

Me: "Sure I can!"

Mom: "Do you have black resin and is it close to the color of my onyx?"

Me: "Well its called smoothcast ONYX, so it better be. :lol: "

I made the piece and you can hardly tell which is one is the real onyx piece. So onyx is good for one thing at least.

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Dec 05, 2009 12:20 pm 
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DLitwin wrote:
These days I wait two months after castign before stickering. It's painful, but less so than bubbled stickers. Patience and a shiny black puzzle is better than a grey puzzle that may bubble anyway :)

My dino made from Onyx is still bubbling after almost two months, though to be fair, most of that time it's been stickered, which presumably slows down the outgassing.

Anyone try using a vacuum chamber?


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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 7:36 pm 
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I'm still unsure after reading this what to do about those air bubbles in the black pieces, I don't want to have to sand the heck out of the pieces, or wait months either. And no, I don't have a vacuum chamber :x

I also heard that Drew puts his cubes in the oven osmewhere, or at least I think I heard that :)


Any suggestions?

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:01 pm 
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Into a microwave? :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 8:08 pm 
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Hugo Mak wrote:
Into a microwave? :lol: :lol: :lol:


Drewseph does no such thing, but he did and maybe still does microwave his molds. You can read more in This Thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 9:48 pm 
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You are probably thinking about how he put his cubes in his furnace room (around 100F I recall he said).

I'm not sure if this speeds things up or not.

Personally, I wait two months. That's right, eight weeks. Rushing will cost you.

Dave

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sun Jan 10, 2010 11:50 pm 
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im pretty sure that was scott

i cannot find the post but, he uses theses aluminum baking sheets
makes a box by placing one upside down on top of the other
cuts a hole in the top one, and sets a light bulb in the hole

alumilite *sweats* and heating then pieces will speed up this process
the *sweat* comes out and releases a gas under the stickers causing pressure and bubbles

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:12 am 
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I don't put my parts in a furnace anymore. I just sand the faces smooth with 200 grit sand paprt and then sticker the part

My Starminx (mini) has yet to form air bubbles. and that was stickered right after casting

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2010 9:07 pm 
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ill have to agree with drew i dont think having a lighter black under the stickers will really make that much of a difference

it looks dark enough when you have the stickers on...plus who buys a puzzle just have it un-stickered?

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 Post subject: Re: Smooth Cast ONYX?!
PostPosted: Sat Jan 16, 2010 7:15 pm 
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Drewseph wrote:
I don't put my parts in a furnace anymore. I just sand the faces smooth with 200 grit sand paprt and then sticker the part

My Starminx (mini) has yet to form air bubbles. and that was stickered right after casting


I'm pretty sure white resin doesn't have the bubbling effect, however I think what I'm going to do is wait 2 days after casting, then cut 2 sets of stickers, apply stickers, send the puzzle, and supply the second set with the puzzle.

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