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 Post subject: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 7:48 pm 
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Hi all, some of you may remember that I posted a thread a while back about the possibility of building a 4x4 minx and for reference, i call it the hyperminx. I've been working on the design for a long time, doodling mechanism parts and such in my notebooks during school and i finally feel i can begin designing the puzzle in 3D CAD(i'm going to use SolidEDGE because i have access to it through my dad's work). The mechanism stems from an eastsheen 4x4 and all the piece proportions will be expanded to fit the dodecahedral shape. To overcome the clearance issues facing the middle layers while turning, i will use caps that will form a rounded star shaped hole such that no layers will have mid-turn intersections. I anticipate seven distinct pieces(edge, corner, hidden edge, hidden center edge, center corner+cap[hopefully one piece], arm+cap[to hide the screw]) in addition to a recycled "stickered" PVC megaminx core. I'm hoping to use printto3d for the masters, but i'm also looking into FDMonly and other 3d printing services for the best price for the best pieces.

Design will start as soon as i am able to remote connect to a computer at my dad's work(hopefully within the week). Pictures will come as i see necessary or *maybe* to fulfill a request here or there. I'll keep this thread updated as much as possible.

-CC10

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Last edited by coastercrazy10 on Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 7:56 pm 
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This sounds awesome! Ialways wondered what a 4x4 minx would look like.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:05 pm 
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I would love some pictures, i am personally having difficulty understanding how it works or what it would look like.


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:25 pm 
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aww.... great job but that kinda sucks.. :(

I was planning on doing this puzzle, but I guess you beat me to it...
well, all I can say is... Good luck! I was just gonna call this the quadraminx by the way, I will probably also be designing one of these in the near future, tommorow I will get Cocreate and start on designing puzzles. Or maybe I should just skip straight to the 6-layered minx(guess it can't be called a hexaminx) maybe I could actually make a spanish name and call it the seis de minxo. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 8:28 pm 
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elijah516 wrote:
aww.... great job but that kinda sucks.. :(

I was planning on doing this puzzle, but I guess you beat me to it...
well, all I can say is... Good luck! I was just gonna call this the quadraminx by the way, I will probably also be designing one of these in the near future, tommorow I will get Cocreate and start on designing puzzles. Or maybe I should just skip straight to the 6-layered minx(guess it can't be called a hexaminx) maybe I could actually make a spanish name and call it the seis de minxo. :lol:

If you've never done any 3D cad before, i'd recommend making some less difficult things (like a 3x3/4x4 cube) to get the hang of the software you're using. And honestly i'd love to see another design for the hyperminx to compare my mech to. There's always room for more puzzles :D

and muffet: the old thread has a drawing of the outside of the puzzle. It's a bit rough but it should give you an idea.

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 11:59 pm 
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coastercrazy10 wrote:
elijah516 wrote:
aww.... great job but that kinda sucks.. :(

I was planning on doing this puzzle, but I guess you beat me to it...
well, all I can say is... Good luck! I was just gonna call this the quadraminx by the way, I will probably also be designing one of these in the near future, tommorow I will get Cocreate and start on designing puzzles. Or maybe I should just skip straight to the 6-layered minx(guess it can't be called a hexaminx) maybe I could actually make a spanish name and call it the seis de minxo. :lol:

If you've never done any 3D cad before, i'd recommend making some less difficult things (like a 3x3/4x4 cube) to get the hang of the software you're using. And honestly i'd love to see another design for the hyperminx to compare my mech to. There's always room for more puzzles :D

and muffet: the old thread has a drawing of the outside of the puzzle. It's a bit rough but it should give you an idea.

-CC10


I have no intention of starting off easy. I like going straight for the hard stuff, but this is not going to be my first project. My first project will probably most likely be a 3x3x5 3D printed cuboid, or maybe a 4x4x1, haven't decided yet. The quadraminx will probably be my 3rd or 4th project.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 12:51 am 
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Muffet wrote:
I would love some pictures, i am personally having difficulty understanding how it works or what it would look like.


PotatoSpades22095 wrote:
This sounds awesome! Ialways wondered what a 4x4 minx would look like.


Here you go guys glad I could help.

viewtopic.php?p=90918#p90918

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx)
PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:27 pm 
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Eh, my design strays a bit from that rendering, but it's good to give a general idea.

Anyway, i'm going to try to install SolidEdge V20 on my computer and see if it runs tomorrow and hopefully start making the core, arms, and the hidden edges/center edges. If all goes well i will post some screenshots of the work.

by the way, the cubies will have side lengths of 1cm, so a whole side is 4cm and the height comes out to 9 cm(4*height = 9*side length, from what i calculated). so it's just a bit bigger than a dogic and MUCH smaller than the gigaminxes i've seen. Maybe i'll design a gigaminx after this and make it a lot smaller and base it on the V-Cube5 mech. but that's putting the cart before the horse.

to wrap up, CAD work will likely start tomorrow. I have most of my dimensions figured out on paper, so i can start making a few pieces right off the bat.

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 8:30 pm 
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Hats off to you if you can make one smaller than Drew's 1.5 . Thats about as small as I would like to go.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 9:30 pm 
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Thanks, i didn't know about the prior posts. i wish i had solid works too.


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:02 pm 
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Actually actually, drews gigaminx 1.5 looks to be about 9 cm tall compared to a 6 cm or so cube in his video here. so if i DID design a gigaminx it would probably be around the size of drew's gigaminx 1.5. sorry if my previous post sounded harsh or stuck up..i didn't realize how small drews 1.5 gigaminx actually was.

It'll certainly be smaller than the teraminx ;)

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 10:05 pm 
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professorcube5x5 wrote:
Hats off to you if you can make one smaller than Drew's 1.5 . Thats about as small as I would like to go.


how small is that exactly?

ha! nevermind, you answered my question right before I posted! :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Sat Nov 22, 2008 2:32 pm 
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Okay, i got my solidEDGE up and running and i decided to make the ES 4x4 parts first to get a handle back on the software. I finished three parts in about two hours...here are some screen shots:
Image
Image
Image

Again, these are ES 4x4 parts, not hyperminx parts. I will hopefully be able to finish my ES 4x4 work and start on hyperminx stuff over thanksgiving break!

Also, correct me if i'm wrong, but since minxes cannot do equator/middle layer turns i don't have to worry about the hidden layers, yes? Since the only way those layers could move is around an axis with the other layers, there's no need to worry about the middle layers going out of place and locking the puzzle up. Again, correct me if i'm wrong.

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 6:48 pm 
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coastercrazy10 wrote:
Also, correct me if i'm wrong, but since minxes cannot do equator/middle layer turns i don't have to worry about the hidden layers, yes? Since the only way those layers could move is around an axis with the other layers, there's no need to worry about the middle layers going out of place and locking the puzzle up. Again, correct me if i'm wrong

You are correct, which is why my Kilominx and Thomas' Impossible Megaminx can work without any blocking of the internal mechanism.

But while you don't have this problem, you do have the problem that the faces intersect each other on a turn. This is the case with any even dodecahedron face turning puzzle. Thomas and I present two different solutions to that problem, and you will have to solve it too. It is not clear to me that either of these solutions will work well on a 4 layer version.

Dave

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Sun Nov 23, 2008 7:33 pm 
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DLitwin wrote:
coastercrazy10 wrote:
Also, correct me if i'm wrong, but since minxes cannot do equator/middle layer turns i don't have to worry about the hidden layers, yes? Since the only way those layers could move is around an axis with the other layers, there's no need to worry about the middle layers going out of place and locking the puzzle up. Again, correct me if i'm wrong

You are correct, which is why my Kilominx and Thomas' Impossible Megaminx can work without any blocking of the internal mechanism.

But while you don't have this problem, you do have the problem that the faces intersect each other on a turn. This is the case with any even dodecahedron face turning puzzle. Thomas and I present two different solutions to that problem, and you will have to solve it too. It is not clear to me that either of these solutions will work well on a 4 layer version.

Dave


I think there are definitely more than 2 solutions to this problem, I came up with 3 ways at one point in time, but I can only think of 2 at the moment, or you could also make a new core that was able to turn diferently then the normal megaminx, which would be a third way, not sure if it would be succesful though.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2008 9:30 am 
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sorry to go a bit off topic, but have a Edges Only Megaminx ever seen the day? if not, then I am gonna jump on that idea RIGTH now!

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Mon Nov 24, 2008 10:00 am 
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Doubleyou wrote:
sorry to go a bit off topic, but have a Edges Only Megaminx ever seen the day? if not, then I am gonna jump on that idea RIGTH now!


Two words: Alexander's Star. Though an edges only minx that is dodecahedron shaped would be awesome still. Especially since Alex's Star was poorly built.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:05 pm 
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Update:

Took about 2-3 hours to get this piece right. I based this off of a "stickered"/PVC megaminx arm which is very similar to a meffert's megaminx arm. However, i included the correct angles and curves such that the circles that the parts rotate in is an actual circle and not a line/curve thing. Here are two screen shots:
Image
Image

If you see anything wrong with it PLEASE let me know. I don't want to start making pieces to work with this piece if there's some flaw with it.

As for the intersecting faces issue, my solution is to, in essense, take a gigaminx face, remove the center cap and center edges, and extend the center corners in such a manner that it makes a rounded star. Then obviously the edges will be truncated to allow for as little rounding as possible on the center corners which will actually be caps since i'm playing off the ES 4x4 mech.

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:06 pm 
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If the mechanism works, then this should be very easy to tune up, because the screws will all be visible. :P Unless you plan to cover them up somehow?

Oh, and I'd like to suggest the alternate name, "Demi-Gigaminx", for this puzzle. It's basically a Gigaminx with a bunch of bits removed, anyway. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 8:14 pm 
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Jared wrote:
If the mechanism works, then this should be very easy to tune up, because the screws will all be visible. :P Unless you plan to cover them up somehow?

Oh, and I'd like to suggest the alternate name, "Demi-Gigaminx", for this puzzle. It's basically a Gigaminx with a bunch of bits removed, anyway. :)

Well technically this puzzle will have more pieces than a gigaminx (because ES 4x4 has more pieces than ES 5x5 due to caps) ;). And i do plan on making some caps for the arms as well, but that will most likely be after i get everything else printed and assembled so i can easily adjust the tension.

Also, i just remembered: The discoloration is due to my graphics card. My graphics card is old and my motherboard doesn't even have a slot for anything better, so when there are 3D objects on the screen sometimes there isn't correct shading. It's kinda lame, i know, but it's all i can do at this point.

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 9:33 pm 
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coastercrazy10 wrote:
Jared wrote:
If the mechanism works, then this should be very easy to tune up, because the screws will all be visible. :P Unless you plan to cover them up somehow?

Oh, and I'd like to suggest the alternate name, "Demi-Gigaminx", for this puzzle. It's basically a Gigaminx with a bunch of bits removed, anyway. :)

Well technically this puzzle will have more pieces than a gigaminx (because ES 4x4 has more pieces than ES 5x5 due to caps) ;). And i do plan on making some caps for the arms as well, but that will most likely be after i get everything else printed and assembled so i can easily adjust the tension.

Also, i just remembered: The discoloration is due to my graphics card. My graphics card is old and my motherboard doesn't even have a slot for anything better, so when there are 3D objects on the screen sometimes there isn't correct shading. It's kinda lame, i know, but it's all i can do at this point.

-CC10


So, after this the Demi-Teraminx shouldn't be too much harder now should it. :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Tue Nov 25, 2008 10:00 pm 
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Hee hee hee. (That's also another reason I suggested the name - it lends itself better to higher-order puzzles. :P)


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): CAD work starts soon soon!
PostPosted: Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:34 am 
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Doubleyou wrote:
sorry to go a bit off topic, but have a Edges Only Megaminx ever seen the day? if not, then I am gonna jump on that idea RIGTH now!


actually, there is one made by chinese guy which also created the 4x4x4 + 2x2x2.
http://bbs.mf8.com.cn/viewthread.php?ti ... a=page%3D1

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 9:19 pm 
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So how's it coming along? It's been at "1/8 parts done" for a few days now.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 11:01 pm 
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I've found an issue with the angles of the center arms, which all other geometry is playing off of. Until i can fix that issue i'm stalled.

-CC10

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Fri Nov 28, 2008 11:57 pm 
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cc10? If you plan on selling this some time in the future, would you think the overall work and value of this puzzle would be more or less than the gigaminx?

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 12:21 am 
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coastercrazy10 wrote:
I've found an issue with the angles of the center arms, which all other geometry is playing off of. Until i can fix that issue i'm stalled.

-CC10


Just a suggestion here, may be too late though. Would it make it simpler instead of creating an extra layer on a kilominx (angled second layer), or just combine a kilominx with a megaminx (center to center cuts & parallel face turns)?

P.S.
I have a paper model, but I cant find my camera...Ill post a pic later. :mrgreen:

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Sat Nov 29, 2008 1:17 am 
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Arch Wolf wrote:
coastercrazy10 wrote:
I've found an issue with the angles of the center arms, which all other geometry is playing off of. Until i can fix that issue i'm stalled.

-CC10


Just a suggestion here, may be too late though. Would it make it simpler instead of creating an extra layer on a kilominx (angled second layer), or just combine a kilominx with a megaminx (center to center cuts & parallel face turns)?

P.S.
I have a paper model, but I cant find my camera...Ill post a pic later. :mrgreen:


One other concept might be to give the arms of the mechanism a little springiness, kind of like the Impossiball.


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:18 pm 
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This is awesome.
I have also been working on a 4th order minx design in AutoCAD, since 2008. But I haven't progressed as far as you have.
Hyperminx sounds like a good name for it... A friend and I decided upon the name Myriaminx (Myria is the greek prefix for 10^4...appropriate as it is a 4-th order dodecahedron, and there is no real arbitrary nomenclature for even order minxes; by previous naming the Kilominx should be a first order minx)
ANYWAY. I respect your designs. Myself I haven't seen a ES mech, not having seen an ES 4x4 before...
My own designs are based on the v-cube 6 mech, and assumes that internal layers won't come out of alignment as the sides are not perpendicular but rather skew at 72º.
In addition I have made the designs compensate for any piece interference (at the centres) by utilising a concept similar to that used by Oskar van Deventer in his Kilominx.
I hope to print it late this year or early next year...delays mainly rooting in the fact that I have bulk exams this year...

Good luck with yours, your way ahead of me... but hey two puzzles of different mechs are always possible :P

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:25 pm 
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Just wanted to point out that hyperminx is already the unofficial name for this puzzle and I think it is much more appropriate for that puzzle. (seeing as a hypercube is a 4d object)

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:42 pm 
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Allagem wrote:
(seeing as a hypercube is a 4d object)

No it isn't. An hypercube is an n-dimensional object.


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 2:32 pm 
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I can't wait to see this puzzle finally made! :D

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 4:27 pm 
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APJ: You should note that this topic was over a year old before "The Second Cuber" posted his comment. I don't know whether coastercrazy10 is still building this thing.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 5:50 pm 
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pirsquared wrote:
APJ: You should note that this topic was over a year old before "The Second Cuber" posted his comment. I don't know whether coastercrazy10 is still building this thing.

-π (Eitan)

Holy crap! You're right.... I totally missed that. How do people find these year old posts anyway? I really only pay attention to those that are on page 1 of each forum.
(but i still think hyperminx is a bad name, hyper- still implies a higher dimension to me)

Peace,
Matt Galla

PS Note to everyone else: the majority of this thread is over a year old!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 6:13 pm 
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Sorry guys, my bad for bumping this post.

I didn't notice that it was over a year old :(
Sorry again.

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 Post subject: Re: Hyperminx(4x4 minx): 1/8 parts done
PostPosted: Thu Jan 28, 2010 7:17 pm 
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Location: Montana
I did that same mistake too quite a few times. It's because if you click "View Unanswered Posts" you get a list of threads in no particular order.

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