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 Post subject: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:01 pm

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
Most people measure solves by time, for obvious reasons, but have you tried counting how many turns you make for a typical solve?

I generally take about 80-100 moves in 75 seconds, though I use a rather inefficient algorithm which I probably couldn't (un)train myself away from even if I tried.

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Last edited by KelvinS on Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:06 pm

Joined: Fri Dec 28, 2012 1:50 pm
Location: Near Las Vegas, NV
It takes me 43 quintillion moves to solve mine!
Joking here obviously, but on average I take 80-100 moves, in about 30 seconds.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 11:09 pm

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
benpuzzles wrote:
It takes me 43 quintillion moves to solve mine!
Joking here obviously, but on average I take 80-100 moves, in about 30 seconds.

Interesting that you manage the same moves in less than half the time. I need faster fingers, or maybe just a faster brain.

How many moves do Felix and Mats manage to make in their 6 seconds? I just want to figure out where I can improve most, in the algorithms I use, or pure finger speed, by comparing both average number of moves and moves per second with the best...

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 5:08 am

Joined: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:02 am
Location: Hertfordshire, UK
You naturally get faster without improving your move count. For example, I average about 70-90 moves in 35 seconds, Im still using the same algorithms and techniques when it took me a minute to solve. Your look ahead and execution of algorithms will get faster through practice

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PB:
3x3:27.34
4x4: 2:21
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Floppy Cube: 4.5sec
2x2: 8.64sec (single)
2x2: 11.78(Average of 5)
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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 5:15 am

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
KozehCubes wrote:
You naturally get faster without improving your move count. For example, I average about 70-90 moves in 35 seconds, Im still using the same algorithms and techniques when it took me a minute to solve. Your look ahead and execution of algorithms will get faster through practice

Well that gives me hope, because I can always practice to improve timing, but I doubt I can ever (un/re)train my brain for new algorithms.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 6:12 am

Joined: Wed Dec 29, 2004 7:57 am
Location: Στο Κάστρο του Αγίου Γεωργίου
...between 60 and 85 moves...

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 6:52 am

Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 7:37 pm
I probably do around 100-120 in 55 seconds these days.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 8:34 am

Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2005 12:31 am
Location: Greece, Australia, Thailand, India, Singapore.
I would say around five hundred (using my tedious - but easy to remember - method).
It takes me around four to five minutes (though if I rush, should be half that).

Pantazis

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 10:24 am

Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2009 2:59 pm
Just did three solves to check -- somewhere in the 80-90 range for me.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:09 am

Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:37 pm
KelvinS wrote:
How many moves do Felix and Mats manage to make in their 6 seconds? I just want to figure out where I can improve most, in the algorithms I use, or pure finger speed, by comparing both average number of moves and moves per second with the best...

Mats Valk used 45 moves for his 5.55 world record solve. That's counting double turns like U2 as one move. You can see the reconstruction here. The 5.66 solve by Feliks Zemdegs was 52 moves. The reconstruction is here.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:16 pm

Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2012 10:56 am
Location: The Netherlands
I just did a slower solve to count, roughly around 70 on an average solve I think.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:30 pm

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
Seems like we're all roughly in the same range...

So it makes me wonder, has anyone counted the moves in Mats Valk's solves? According to his Youtube video, his 5.55s solve was as follows:

x y`F R D L F
U R U` R` U y` R` U R
y U2 R` U` R
y2 U R U` R` y U R U` R`
y` U` R U R` U R U` R`
R2

So how many moves is this? I'm not familiar with the x y notation...

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 3:51 pm

Joined: Thu Sep 17, 2009 6:07 am
Location: Germany, Bavaria
KelvinS wrote:
Seems like we're all roughly in the same range...

So it makes me wonder, has anyone counted the moves in Mats Valk's solves? According to his Youtube video, his 5.55s solve was as follows:

x y`F R D L F
U R U` R` U y` R` U R
y U2 R` U` R
y2 U R U` R` y U R U` R`
y` U` R U R` U R U` R`
R2

So how many moves is this? I'm not familiar with the x y notation...
I'm counting 33 moves. x,y,z are rotations of the whole cube around the three axes.
These are not counted as moves in a fewest moves competition.
WCA regulations 2013 wrote:
12a3b) Each rotation is counted as 0 moves.
12b) Rotations for all cube shaped puzzles:
12b1) Clockwise, 90 degrees: [f] or z, [b] or z', [r] or x, [l] or x', [u] or y, [d] or y'.
12b2) Anti-clockwise, 90 degrees: [f'] or z', [b'] or z, [r'] or x', [l'] or x, [u'] or y', [d'] or y.
12b3) 180 degrees: [f2] or z2, [b2] or z2, [r2] or x2, [l2] or x2, [u2] or y2, [d2] or y2.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:22 pm

Joined: Thu Jul 23, 2009 5:06 pm
Location: Berkeley, CA, USA
KelvinS wrote:
Seems like we're all roughly in the same range...

So it makes me wonder, has anyone counted the moves in Mats Valk's solves? According to his Youtube video, his 5.55s solve was as follows:

x y`F R D L F
U R U` R` U y` R` U R
y U2 R` U` R
y2 U R U` R` y U R U` R`
y` U` R U R` U R U` R`
R2

So how many moves is this? I'm not familiar with the x y notation...

This reconstruction is not complete. PLL is missing.

See this post for the complete one:

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showt ... -Mats-Valk

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:57 pm

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
schuma wrote:
This reconstruction is not complete. PLL is missing.

See this post for the complete one:

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showt ... -Mats-Valk

Hi Schuma, I saw that video, and it pointed to this one posted by Mats himself, which gave the sequence above:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation ... hTMm85G9GE

So how many moves? Anyone?

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 9:29 pm

Joined: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:37 pm
KelvinS wrote:
schuma wrote:
This reconstruction is not complete. PLL is missing.

See this post for the complete one:

http://www.speedsolving.com/forum/showt ... -Mats-Valk

Hi Schuma, I saw that video, and it pointed to this one posted by Mats himself, which gave the sequence above:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation ... hTMm85G9GE

So how many moves? Anyone?

It's 45 moves; that's counting double turns like U2 as one turn.

schuma is right - that reconstruction is incomplete. If you watch a slow motion version of the solve, you can see that the last turn is U2, not R2. Also, in the link that schuma gave, click the Show button next to Reconstruction under the video. That will show the moves that were used.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 3:07 am

Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 10:13 am
Location: Norway
Typically, a fewest moves solve takes me 1 hr or more. And I need on average 35-40 turns for that. Less if I allow taking back turns and using insertions (for last few corners). My PB is 19 turns, taking me almost one day to compolete

Per

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Mon Apr 01, 2013 11:06 am

Joined: Mon Mar 30, 2009 5:13 pm
Zeotor wrote:
KelvinS wrote:
So how many moves? Anyone?
It's 45 moves; that's counting double turns like U2 as one turn.
perfredlund wrote:
Typically, a fewest moves solve takes me 1 hr or more. And I need on average 35-40 turns for that. Less if I allow taking back turns and using insertions (for last few corners). My PB is 19 turns, taking me almost one day to compolete

These stats are quite amazing!

Has anyone else tried a minimal move solve like perfredlund?

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:53 am

Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 10:13 am
Location: Norway
Check out this site:

http://fmc.mustcube.net/

Online fewest move site coded and organised by me It has been going on for years with weekly challenges

Per

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Wed Jun 05, 2013 5:48 am

Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 1:11 am
perfredlund wrote:
Typically, a fewest moves solve takes me 1 hr or more. And I need on average 35-40 turns for that. Less if I allow taking back turns and using insertions (for last few corners). My PB is 19 turns, taking me almost one day to compolete

Per

:O That's amazing.

I noticed that some of you average 35 seconds or so, but use like 80-100 moves. Do you guys lookahead or have high TPS?
I average around 35 seconds and use 50-60 moves.

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 Post subject: Re: How many moves do you take for a 3x3?Posted: Thu Jun 06, 2013 6:18 am

Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2009 4:38 pm
Location: Hungary, Budapest
Average moves is around 60-65 for me. (double moves, like u2, count 2 moves)
And the average time is 22-25 sec.

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