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 Post subject: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:02 pm 
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i took an IQ test today, and ended up getting a 144 :mrgreen:

the test can be found here http://www.funeducation.com/Tests/IQTes ... sting.aspx

good luck and please post results.

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Last edited by phailthequail on Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:20 pm 
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Took it, believe I did very well, then realized you had to pay 10 bucks to get your lousy results.


I'm pretty mad you didn't mention that before I took it. What a scam.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:32 pm 
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Online IQ tests are not accurate. I took a standardized IQ test a few years ago and scored a 171. This was just after I finished college. My parents had me take a similar test when I was 11 years old and scored a 165 for my age group. Your IQ can only be determined by legitimate IQ tests. The online tests are just a way to make money. My friend and I took one about a year ago and I scored a 184! That is far too different than my standardized score to be accurate. I know I'm pretty smart...but I'm not that smart! :wink:

- Billy


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:45 pm 
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EMarx wrote:
Took it, believe I did very well, then realized you had to pay 10 bucks to get your lousy results.


I'm pretty mad you didn't mention that before I took it. What a scam.

i beleive that it should email them to you, i will check again to make sure its the right one.

sorry :oops:

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:47 pm 
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ya they just send you a general one not all 13

124 :oops:


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:52 pm 
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i found the grading scale.


80-90 (below average)
90-110 (average intelligence)
111-121 (above average)
122-130 (highly intelligent)
131-141 (gifted)
142+ (genius - top 1%)

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 19, 2009 11:54 pm 
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phailthequail wrote:
142+ (genius - top 1%)

Correction:
Thats more Unhuman-Robot :solved:

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graytman wrote:
i dont kniow how to make a megaminx:(


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 1:29 am 
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I have never taken an IQ test. I believe I'm some way above average (probably not for this forum!), but I'm far more interested in making the most of what I have got, whatever that may be, than paying to hear some theoretical limit of my potential, almost like going to a fortune teller. In any case, I think emotional intelligence is a far, FAR more important factor to succeed in life. I know of many highly intelligent people who could never achieve anything, maintain a stable relationship, get promoted, or even hold down a job.

My two cents worth. :)

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:40 am 
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I accidentally did the 18+ test, but still got 133 :P

-Mark- :)

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:25 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
I have never taken an IQ test. I believe I'm some way above average (probably not for this forum!), but I'm far more interested in making the most of what I have got, whatever that may be, than paying to hear some theoretical limit of my potential, almost like going to a fortune teller. In any case, I think emotional intelligence is a far, FAR more important factor to succeed in life. I know of many highly intelligent people who could never achieve anything, maintain a stable relationship, get promoted, or even hold down a job.

My two cents worth. :)


I agree with Kelvin that emotional intelligence is very important. IQ tests do not test for that or kinesthetic intelligence, which I also regard as important.

IQ tests are limited in several ways, not least of which is the assumption that what you can do with your brain today is all that you'll ever be able to do with it. Even if the measurement of intelligence at the present time was accurate, which it isn't, that assumption is false. If you are interested, you can look up the recent work done regarding brain plasticity.

I could go on (for waaay too long a time), but instead I recommend a book called "The Mismeasure of Man" Stephen Jay Gould.

DJ

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 4:46 pm 
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David J wrote:
Kelvin Stott wrote:
I have never taken an IQ test. I believe I'm some way above average (probably not for this forum!), but I'm far more interested in making the most of what I have got, whatever that may be, than paying to hear some theoretical limit of my potential, almost like going to a fortune teller. In any case, I think emotional intelligence is a far, FAR more important factor to succeed in life. I know of many highly intelligent people who could never achieve anything, maintain a stable relationship, get promoted, or even hold down a job.

My two cents worth. :)


I agree with Kelvin that emotional intelligence is very important. IQ tests do not test for that or kinesthetic intelligence, which I also regard as important.

IQ tests are limited in several ways, not least of which is the assumption that what you can do with your brain today is all that you'll ever be able to do with it. Even if the measurement of intelligence at the present time was accurate, which it isn't, that assumption is false. If you are interested, you can look up the recent work done regarding brain plasticity.

I could go on (for waaay too long a time), but instead I recommend a book called "The Mismeasure of Man" Stephen Jay Gould.

DJ

*


Well, an intelligence quotient test, (IQ test) is not going to tell how one can function in the world (for example, jobs, relationships, etc etc.) its main purpose is to see how fast and correctly you can process information. (that's probably why most people here have above average scores!) :scrambled: --> :solved:

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:01 pm 
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I think that if someone wants to truly test their intelligence then they should take a real, legitimate, standardized IQ test. I think most of the people that say IQ tests do not reflect their actual intelligence are afraid that they won't score well on one.

I'll be honest...when I was a kid I thought that I wasn't going to do as well as I did. Yes, I was in honors...yes, I did well on other standardized tests, but I was scared that I was not going to be as high as I wanted to be. It turned out that I did even better than I thought I would.

After I scored so high as a kid, I had the same fear when I took it after college. I thought that I would be average. When I scored a 171 I was ecstatic! But, it doesn't really matter what my IQ is. I can't get a $100,000 a year job with my high IQ score. That's not what an IQ is for. It's not there to tell you what you'll be in life. It's there to show, as phailthequail mentioned above, how well your brain processes information.

So, if you really want to know how smart you are then take a standardized IQ test. They really are thorough and an accurate assessment of ones intelligence. Sorry to disappoint those who think they're not useful. :wink:

- Billy


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:10 pm 
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"USE-ful?" Useful for what, exactly?

Admittedly I have taken many similar tests as part of job applications, etc. (and have usually done quite well), but I took those because I had to, that's what I call useful. Otherwise why do the results mean anything or count for anything? Just an honest question begging a logical answer...

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:20 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
"USE-ful?" Useful for what, exactly?

Admittedly I have taken many similar tests as part of job applications, etc. (and have usually done quite well), but I took those because I had to, that's what I call useful. Otherwise why do the results mean anything or count for anything? Just an honest question begging a logical answer...

Useful for determining your intelligence...you know.....the subject at hand. :wink:

- Billy

PS: The tests you take for a job application do not even compare with real IQ tests. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:28 pm 
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And determining your intelligence is useful for what? Or do we have a circular argument here? :D.

Anyway, I'm just not convinced these tests have any real use or meaning in real life, but perhaps understand that some people have a different view. Enough from me on this topic...

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:40 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
And determining your intelligence is useful for what? Or do we have a circular argument here? :D

I have already stated that the only thing your IQ score is useful for is knowing your intelligence level. Did you read my post?

lonogod wrote:
But, it doesn't really matter what my IQ is. I can't get a $100,000 a year job with my high IQ score. That's not what an IQ is for. It's not there to tell you what you'll be in life. It's there to show, as phailthequail mentioned above, how well your brain processes information.

I'm not going to post here again. PM me if you would like to continue this discussion...though arguments are pointless because neither party will ever agree with the other...hence the argument to begin with.

I will say, however, that I get the feeling that you're one of those people who are afraid that they will not score well on an IQ test. Don't sweat it...they're not useful for anything except for what they're intended for. :wink:

- Billy


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 6:02 pm 
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The test linked above keeps freezing up when I attempt to take it, but I did take the Mensa home test back in 2007. I got a raw score of 73, which gives me an estimated IQ of 132 and places me at the 98th percentile.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:51 pm 
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I got 121. But i typed in 19 for my age (in case they didn't allow under age kids(im 13)) so my results are probably way off.


EDIT: so I guess I'm above average for a 19 year old :).

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:12 pm 
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when i was in 4th grade i got a 127 on an regular iq test

havent taken one since

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:25 pm 
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There is no such thing as a genius!
(everyone has a talent in something, you need to find it,
so if you haven't been called a genius yet, stop being lazy!)

And all those IQ tests are too dependable in mathematics,
language, and specialized trivia (but they can be good for confidence!)

:mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:37 pm 
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kastellorizo wrote:
There is no such thing as a genius!
(everyone has a talent in something, you need to find it,
so if you haven't been called a genius yet, stop being lazy!)

And all those IQ tests are too dependable in mathematics,
language, and specialized trivia (but they can be good for confidence!)

:mrgreen:


Pantazis

what if im a genius in the art of laziness?


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 12:43 am 
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eye2eye wrote:
what if im a genius in the art of laziness?


The trick is that *others* must be the ones calling you a genius,
not you calling yourself. And if you can achieve that with laziness,
I salute you!

:lol:


Pantazis

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 1:03 am 
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My dad once got a 145 on a legit IQ test


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 1:24 am 
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kastellorizo wrote:
eye2eye wrote:
what if im a genius in the art of laziness?


The trick is that *others* must be the ones calling you a genius,
not you calling yourself. And if you can achieve that with laziness,
I salute you!

:lol:


Pantazis


But what if the people calling me a genius don't know what they're talking about? For instance, one of my friends put up a picture of my megaminx on facebook with the caption "You have to be a genius to solve this." Does that make me and everyone else who can solve one a genius?

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:00 am 
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Danny Devitt wrote:
But what if the people calling me a genius don't know what they're talking about? For instance, one of my friends put up a picture of my megaminx on facebook with the caption "You have to be a genius to solve this." Does that make me and everyone else who can solve one a genius?


I said "others", not "one". Then, and only then, we can have a healthy majority of different types
of people, some of which will know well the subject, and who then will have to agree with the final conclusion.
And you don't have to be a genius to realise that!

:wink:


Pantazis

PS. Plus, I believe that solving the Megaminx without being taught by others any hints or tricks,
and using *solely* your own method, is a considerable factor to be called a genius.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:05 am 
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Well by that logic I must be a super genius, having solved 123 puzzles on GB alone. :wink:

But now I'm just being difficult :lol:

In all seriousness, I tend to agree with what you've said.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:17 am 
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Danny Devitt wrote:
Well by that logic I must be a super genius, having solved 123 puzzles on GB alone. :wink:

But now I'm just being difficult :lol:

In all seriousness, I tend to agree with what you've said.



Solving puzzles is part of training the mind to solve more problems.
And when someone can apply such raw logic to more fields, especially
in real life, success is guaranteed because of the involved efficiency.

A genius is in fact, someone who can excel in many different fields.

So someone who is one-hand-solving a megaminx, with his own method,
while juggling on a unicycle, and while talking on the phone about shares
(which will prove to be successful in the near future), is a genius!

:mrgreen:


Pantazis

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:36 am 
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Solving a megaminx: check
Using own method: check
One-handed: Never tried before, but I'm sure I could do it.
Juggling: I can juggle okay, but not to the degree that would be needed
Unicycling: Never tried.
Talking on the phone: check
About shares which will prove to be successful in the near future: I could guess, but I don't really know much about the stock market.

It seems I still have a way to go.

Also, ↓

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:55 am 
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I took an IQ test in elementary school, I don't remember the score though.

I did get into the gifted program though.


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 4:28 am 
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kastellorizo wrote:
There is no such thing as a genius!
(everyone has a talent in something, you need to find it,
so if you haven't been called a genius yet, stop being lazy!)

BRILLIANT POST!!!

I feel uncomfortable with the idea (which is never explicitly stated, but very often implied, and even accepted) that IQ is somehow a superior talent to have than many other, frankly more useful talents. IQ tests put people in boxes and lose sight of their true value to society. That's why I will never take an IQ test: not because I'm scared of the result, but because I just don't like the idea of being judged or labelled (whether as genius or dimwit!) and stuck in a box by someone who doesn't even know me.

And so to Pantazis' point: everyone is unique, with their own special talents. In the end, I believe it's what people actually do with their talents that should be judged, not a sheet of paper with some theoretical number indicating what box they should be put in:

phailthequail wrote:
i found the grading scale.

80-90 (below average)
90-110 (average intelligence)
111-121 (above average)
122-130 (highly intelligent)
131-141 (gifted)
142+ (genius - top 1%)

See what I mean?

Having said all this, I do appreciate that some people may want to take the test, whether for their own personal curiosity, pride, or even self-confidence, which is fine. Personally, however, I don't feel the need or see any value to take the test myself, but that's just me.

:D

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:47 pm 
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lonogod wrote:
I think that if someone wants to truly test their intelligence then they should take a real, legitimate, standardized IQ test. I think most of the people that say IQ tests do not reflect their actual intelligence are afraid that they won't score well on one.[snip]


..and then there are those who who score very well who still understand that IQ tests do not measure accurately.

lonogod wrote:
So, if you really want to know how smart you are then take a standardized IQ test. They really are thorough and an accurate assessment of ones intelligence. Sorry to disappoint those who think they're not useful. :wink:

- Billy


...and then there are those who test well and those who don't...

Please, read the book I mentioned and get back to me.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:56 am 
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David J wrote:
I recommend a book called "The Mismeasure of Man" Stephen Jay Gould.

In another of his books, "Emotional Intelligence at Work", he reveals that among successful business leaders there is a strong statistical correlation with emotional intelligence, which is really not surprising since good business leaders need to understand, manage and work with other people. But, what was very surprising is that he actually found a slight NEGATIVE correlation with IQ!

:shock:

So if anyone thinks their boss is "stupid", now you know why he's your boss! :lol:

But seriously, this makes complete sense: a "stupid" boss that can manage a bunch of more intelligent people to think "hey, I should be in that position, I will work hard to prove I am more capable" will lead a stable and productive business/organization. On the other hand, an intelligent boss who looks down on his "stupid" employees will quickly lose their loyalty, commitment and productivity. Eventually they will just leave and there will be nothing left of the business.

Now that's food for thought - especially for anyone with aspirations of job promotion and leadership...

And that's why the last thing I want is to be labelled as a genius, so maybe I AM scared of taking an IQ test! :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:35 am 
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Correlation does not imply causation!

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:42 am 
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Danny Devitt wrote:

Thanks, as a former scientist I'm fully aware of this, I was being deliberately provocative :shock: just to stimulate further thought and discussion :P

Besides, I certainly wasn't implying that people get promoted because they are stupid, but because they are less likely to treat their colleagues as stupid:

Kelvin Stott wrote:
But seriously, this makes complete sense: a "stupid" boss that can manage a bunch of more intelligent people to think "hey, I should be in that position, I will work hard to prove I am more capable" will lead a stable and productive business/organization. On the other hand, an intelligent boss who looks down on his "stupid" employees will quickly lose their loyalty, commitment and productivity. Eventually they will just leave and there will be nothing left of the business.

In short, I think people would rather have a stupid boss who treats them with respect than an intelligent one who treats them like they're stupid, right? To illustrate my point here's a good example of someone who claims to have a high IQ treating other members as stupid. Hence, as I pointed out earlier, emotional intelligence is a far, far more important factor for success in life than IQ. A wasted genius is almost a proverb, because of that very fact.

Still, I'm keen to hear any other ideas/theories to explain the negative correlation between IQ and leadership/success. :D

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Last edited by KelvinS on Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:51 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 8:39 am 
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I started to take the test, but I got bored, I am only 13 so I did find it rather challenging =P

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:27 am 
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Quote:
====================================
Here's your Test Results Information
====================================

Hi xxxxxxxxxx

Thank you for taking our Kids IQ Test on xxxxxxxxx

If you wish to return to your test or results, please complete the following:

1. Sign in to your account:
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

2. Click on the "My Results" tab

3. Click on "View Results" for tests you have completed or click on "Finish Test" if you have not yet finished the test. You must finish the test to view the results.

The test is administered on a sliding scale based on age. If a young child answers 5 questions incorrectly in one section, then the rest of the questions in that section are skipped. The questions go in order from easiest to hardest so the youngest children are only expected to answer a few in each section. The scoring mechanism is also based on the child's age, so young children are scored much easier than older children.

We based our test and scoring algorithm on the test scores of over 2,000 children from age 6 to 16. The test was created and validated by our PhD-level psychologists.

Please note that it costs $12.95 to view the results of this test.

Retrieve Login Information:
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Delete Your Account:
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX


Thank you for registering! We welcome any feedback you might have to improve your experience: xxxxxxxxxxxx

Sincerely,

FunEducation.com Welcome Team
http://www.funeducation.com



I followed the instructions, but still got the payment window.

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Last edited by Retr0 on Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:38 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:30 am 
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Hey Retr0,

I just clicked on the links and paid to see your results - VERY interesting! :shock:

(only joking :lol: )

PS - be careful with personal info on the net :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 9:39 am 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
Hey Retr0,

I just clicked on the links and paid to see your results - VERY interesting! :shock:

(only joking :lol: )

PS - be careful with personal info on the net :wink:


Scared me for a sec :lol: How do I access my results from here?

I've blocked out all personal URLs out now.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 1:49 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
Still, I'm keen to hear any other ideas/theories to explain the negative correlation between IQ and leadership/success. :D
An explanation I read a long time ago, which I find persuasive, is that executives with a high IQ have a tendency to "stumble over their brains". Being a successful leader is often about making plans, and justifying them if need be, confidently. Who is more likely to be successful at this? A 115 IQ person who can see a few complexities of a scenario, or a 130 IQ person who can see a whole freaking quagmire of complexities? "Ignorance is bliss" for the 115 IQ person in that situation. By not perceiving many potential problems, he or she is less encumbered by them, rather like an innocent child who enthusiastically leaps across a gap while hillwalking -- "Yay! Easy! Come on!" :D -- that's leadership for ya! -- whereas an older person is more likely to be thinking, "Yikes, what if I trip, what if I don't quite make it, what if a gust of wind blows as I start to jump?" :? "Keep it simple, stupid." Pretty bright, but not too bright, is probably the best recipe for solving problems in the workplace, and achieving promotion.

There could also be a tendency of brainy people to be too stuck in their heads and less able to show "heart" as well -- the natural people skills and rapport that also lead to promotion in organizations. That's along the lines of what you've already said. It wouldn't surprise me if there is a slightly negative correlation between IQ and emotional intelligence above a certain level of IQ.


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:05 pm 
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Yes, I see what you mean, this makes sense: not getting too caught up with complex thoughts might enable more simple and effective decision making and communication.

Or to put more simply, perhaps people with very high IQ tend to spend more time thinking about things and less time actually doing things and interacting with other people.

As with everything in life, the best recipe is the right balance.

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Last edited by KelvinS on Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:20 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
Yes, I see what you mean, this makes sense: not getting too caught up with complex thoughts might enable more simple and effective decision making and communication.
It makes sense in the workplace; but also in other areas of life... like shopping :D (For an example, see xkcd).

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 2:25 pm 
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Skarabajo wrote:
Kelvin Stott wrote:
Yes, I see what you mean, this makes sense: not getting too caught up with complex thoughts might enable more simple and effective decision making and communication.
It makes sense in the workplace; but also in other areas of life... like shopping :D (For an example, see xkcd).

Skarabajo.

SPOT ON, HILARIOUS! :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 7:24 pm 
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Sorry for the slight bump, I just remembered another thing I don't like about IQ tests: In many cases there are several legitimate answers, which it seems even the people setting the test may not have appreciated.

For example, here's one question taken from a "legitimate" IQ test:

Q. Which letter is the odd one out: F Z A E H

Hmmm, well, it depends on how you look at it...

F is the only letter that has no symmetry (rotation or reflection)
Z is the only letter that you can write without taking your pen off the paper (single pen stroke)
Z is the only letter not appearing in the first half of the alphabet
Z is the only letter not appearing in the days of the week, or in the months of the year
E is the only letter with four straight lines (the others all have three)
H is the only letter with BOTH rotational and reflective symmetry
H is the only letter that is not pronounced using the vocal cords, teeth, toungue, lips, etc.

So what's the "right" answer?

I would probably choose A, because it's the only letter that ISN'T the odd one out! :lol:

See what I mean? The problem is that IQ tests are often about GUESSING what criteria the people had in mind when they set the questions. And that's pure luck, nothing to do with intelligence! :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2009 8:13 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
Q. Which letter is the odd one out: F Z A E H

Hmmm, well, it depends on how you look at it...


When I was younger (O.K., O.K., I still do it now sometimes if I'm bored enough), I would fill in the gaps of letters that had "holes" with my pencil. These letters include A, B, D, O, P, Q, R, a, b, d, e, g, o, p, and q. (I think that's all of them). This is just adding another interpretation, but my immediate response would be "A! It's the only one that creates a gap inside the letter!"


I've taken a few IQ tests online, and I think I actually took a legit one at school in 8th grade (I discovered a school document when I was cleaning my room a few months back). I don't remember taking that test, but I apparently did alright which is always reassuring :P


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 10:42 am 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
Sorry for the slight bump, I just remembered another thing I don't like about IQ tests: In many cases there are several legitimate answers, which it seems even the people setting the test may not have appreciated.

For example, here's one question taken from a "legitimate" IQ test:

Q. Which letter is the odd one out: F Z A E H

Hmmm, well, it depends on how you look at it...

F is the only letter that has no symmetry (rotation or reflection)
Z is the only letter that you can write without taking your pen off the paper (single pen stroke)
Z is the only letter not appearing in the first half of the alphabet
Z is the only letter not appearing in the days of the week, or in the months of the year
E is the only letter with four straight lines (the others all have three)
H is the only letter with BOTH rotational and reflective symmetry
H is the only letter that is not pronounced using the vocal cords, teeth, toungue, lips, etc.

So what's the "right" answer?

I would probably choose A, because it's the only letter that ISN'T the odd one out! :lol:

See what I mean? The problem is that IQ tests are often about GUESSING what criteria the people had in mind when they set the questions. And that's pure luck, nothing to do with intelligence! :wink:
I'd say E is the intended correct answer because these tests are usually strictly timed and counting straight lines is probably the quickest way of visually making one letter the odd one out. But of course I agree that the question sucks! Unstated assumptions, poorly written questions that unnecessarily introduce ambiguities, yuck. Testee: "Is that a European or African swallow?" Tester: "Er... I don't know..." and the tester is vanquished. :lol:

IQ tests seem to be based on what a small subset of smart people assume are decent ways of testing for intelligence based on their impression/measurement of what most smart people have in common. Some tests claim not to be knowledge-based at all, but do take certain knowledge for granted. What about testees whose attitude and/or life circumstances mean that certain knowledge is of no interest/relevance, hence was never acquired?

"Officially administered" IQ tests usually have tough time limits, including WAIS-III (the "gold standard" according to some). That opens a can of worms by itself. Why not include a test with a very generous time limit? Or have a sliding scale where you get more points for answering a question correctly very quickly, fewer points but some credit for answering correctly more slowly, and no credit at all once a certain time limit has been exceeded for that question (most suitable for online testing)? What about areas of human endeavor where it's crucial to have people who can figure out 10/10 of challenging problems in a reasonable length of time? Who will be better for these, Mr Speedy-but-flawed Gonzales who solves 8/10 really quickly, but through carelessness or a lack of ability to penetrate certain subtleties that require time and effort and patience, rarely scores 10/10, even when given plenty of time?

What of people who don't solve problems well in isolation but make valuable contributions to groups?

What of people who sometimes have mental blocks preventing them from figuring out certain concepts for themselves, but once given a helping hand along the way, can run and run and run with their minds? A classic example with twisty puzzles is the large group of people including me who didn't grasp the commutator concept when we were young, then after reading a solution to the Rubik's Cube, understood it and had no problem combining it with other techniques to subsequently solve a wide variety of twisty puzzles. Now would I eventually have figured out commutators for myself? Maybe, maybe not, I don't care. It was a vital stepping stone and I don't need to figure out everything myself. All our lives benefit from the ideas and achievements of bright people of this and previous generations.

What of creativity, those difficult-to-measure, off-the-wall lightbulb moments? There could be sparkly people out there who wouldn't score particularly well in an IQ test, but with a thoughtful observation, "Why don't you X, Y, and Z?", that friend or relative of a scientist triggers a spark that leads to a significant breakthrough in clean energy or another of humanity's pressing needs. As Dr Gregory House said so simply in a recent episode, "Yeah, but her wrong idea led to his right one," rightly complimenting a young intern who jumped in with an angle that hadn't occurred to the others and ended up saving the patient's life. (I don't buy into the quaint stereotype of the lone, brilliant scientist who bashes away in isolation and suddenly makes an astounding advance with no collaboration whatsoever. Just because there are striking examples of this from previous centuries doesn't mean that the stereotype has any relevance to our age.) This point ties in with what you have already said, Kelvin, about the categorizing or limiting of someone's perceived potential when interpreting the results of an IQ test.

I'm also not convinced by tests that claim not to have any cultural bias. I'd get a kick out of watching a self-appointed Western boffin miserably fail a "basic intelligence test" administered by so-called "simple tribal people", and huff and puff various excuses as to why the test is "unfair". Especially if every single question could be demonstrated to be based on logic, visio-spatial awareness, etc. Simple example: "You have 10 seconds to move two of these sticks to form a logical arrangement." Answer: "Move this and this, and you get an arrow pointing to the water source over there. Easy, yes?" Western boffin: "No! Wait! That isn't the only shape you could make with reflective symmetry, is it? And how am I supposed to know the water has anything to do with the question?!" Tribal guy: "Isn't part of intelligence adaptability to different circumstances? Didn't you notice the habit we all have in this village of pointing out key locations with arrows made by natural objects, when you were shown around prior to the test? Weren't you paying attention? Isn't that an obvious pattern from which you could extrapolate?" Western boffin: "Um... I..." FAIL. Now I suspect that the "fish out of water" scenario above can also happen more subtly within the same country or region across cultural or educational divides. Just because many or most intelligent people are adept at answering questions of a very particular slant doesn't mean that it's going to be a fair measure of all or nearly all people.

I must read the book David J recommended, I think I'll enjoy it. :)


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 1:14 pm 
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Kelvin Stott wrote:
Sorry for the slight bump, I just remembered another thing I don't like about IQ tests: In many cases there are several legitimate answers, which it seems even the people setting the test may not have appreciated.

For example, here's one question taken from a "legitimate" IQ test:

Q. Which letter is the odd one out: F Z A E H

Hmmm, well, it depends on how you look at it...

F is the only letter that has no symmetry (rotation or reflection)
Z is the only letter that you can write without taking your pen off the paper (single pen stroke)
Z is the only letter not appearing in the first half of the alphabet
Z is the only letter not appearing in the days of the week, or in the months of the year
E is the only letter with four straight lines (the others all have three)
H is the only letter with BOTH rotational and reflective symmetry
H is the only letter that is not pronounced using the vocal cords, teeth, toungue, lips, etc.

So what's the "right" answer?

I would probably choose A, because it's the only letter that ISN'T the odd one out! :lol:

See what I mean? The problem is that IQ tests are often about GUESSING what criteria the people had in mind when they set the questions. And that's pure luck, nothing to do with intelligence! :wink:

Image

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 2:44 pm 
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diverging a bit: http://www.fun-with-words.com/word_gry_ ... ungry.html


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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 4:30 pm 
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Notoday wrote:
This is just adding another interpretation, but my immediate response would be "A! It's the only one that creates a gap inside the letter!"

Ah, well spotted, I knew there would be something but didn't quite catch that one. And just like those letters, we are all individual and unique in our own special way. :D

@ Julian - vey interesting post, thanks for adding this, very nice insight.

@ Danny - :lol:

@ Tamaness - Fashion and Cushion, too easy!

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:34 pm 
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Door wrote:
I accidentally did the 18+ test, but still got 133 :P


Here's question 1 from the kid's IQ test:
Quote:
What is the color of blood?


I took the 18+ test too, despite being under 18, and though I didn't give them my email address, I think I did really good.

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2x2 1.xx (2.88)
3x3 11.xx (15.81)
4x4 1:18.26 (1:24.63)
5x5 (3:00.02)
6x6 4:26.05 (6:34.68)
7x7 6:38.74 (9:48.81)
OH (35.63)

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 Post subject: Re: IQ
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2009 5:41 pm 
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Quote:
What is the color of blood?

And the problem with this question is not that it's "easy", but that it asumes we know which creature we're talking about (some have green blood).

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