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 Post subject: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 21, 2010 8:01 pm 
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Has there even been a puzzle that you think to yourself. How do they build it? How did they come up with the idea? What type of core does it use?
There have been two puzzles that I have truely thought that. First the Tuttminx then the BIgBoulder. I think they are just incredable really wish I had one.(like I could ever pay for either) There is one thing I dont get about the Tuttminx, why cant it quite turn fully funtioned? And what type of core does the big boulder have?

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 12:16 am 
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The tuttminx can't be "fully functionally" for the same reason a pentagonal prism isn't fully functional. The angles are wrong. You can't make 60 degree turns unless you do weird stuff to it.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 1:27 am 
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Remember that the angles on a pentagon are 72 degees, where as the hexagonal faces are 60 degrees. But I'm pretty sure that you'd get use to it after playing with it for a while. Fudging could also be used for making an 'intermixable' Tuttminx.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 5:37 am 
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jak3434 wrote:
And what type of core does the big boulder have?

The Big Boulder has a spherical core, with screw holes reflecting the geometry of the Pentagonal Hexecontahedron, based on pictures and text posted by Oskar in the original thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 3:53 pm 
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The two puzzles you mention ar both quite shallow, which makes for a Rubik's Cube style mechanism; centers, edges and corners. A bit more difficult of course, but moere difficult mechanisms are in the deeper cut puzzles or puzzles consisting of multiple onion shells, like Drewseph's recent chopasaurus, of which he posted a picture very few of us are able to try to understand.

A good example of these onion layered mechanisms is the Pyraminx Crystal / Brillic. It has a brillic over a megaminx. And if you put a layer over THAT you get the starminx, over THAT you get the master pentultimate, and over THAT you get the Pentultimate

To my knowledge at least.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 5:12 pm 
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The Tuttminx IS fully functional! Once again people are expecting extra moves through there own misunderstandings. You could equally (more so in fact) claim a Super Nova isn't fully functional since it doesn't move like Drewseph's Chopasaurus or Christoph's Magic Jewel isn't fully functional since it doesn't move like a Truncated Face Turning Octahedron. The Tuttminx is a superb fully working, fully functional puzzle. Please don't insult him by claiming otherwise.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 22, 2010 5:21 pm 
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I agree with Tony; the geometry should explain any misgivings. However with the Tuttminx, I should present the challenge to any builder to make what some people think possible: interchangeability of the pentagonal and hexagonal faces, most likely to be done through the use of fudging.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 1:48 am 
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I think fudging could be used to make the puzzle interchangable, but then that gets rid of the fun. I'd imagine you run into a few irritating situations with double turns required.

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 Post subject: Re: Unreal puzzles...
PostPosted: Thu Sep 23, 2010 9:19 am 
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Methinks the Onion-like layers of the Little Chop are unreal. That's one beast of a mechanism for a puzzle that's only got 24 outer parts!!!

Pentultimate's another one. You either rely on the 12-layer "Knucklehead" mech, or a buildup of many puzzles (an onion mech):
Megaminx -> Pyraminx Christal/Brillic -> Starminx V1 -> Master Pentultimate -> Pentultimate

BTW, I own a print of Oskar's Big Boulder :mrgreen:

If Oskar can "fudge" a square into a pentagon and visa-versa, the pentagon has a centroid angle of 72 while a square has a centroid of 90. The vertex angle of a pentagon is 108, compared to 90 again for the square. Either way you look at it, that is a fudged difference of 18 degrees.

The hexagon has a centroid angle of 60, with an vertex angle of 120. Either way you cut it, that is a difference of only 12 degrees between the fundamental angles of the pentagon and hexagon. Therefore, I reason that it will be considerably easier to "fudge" a Tutt-Minx (with all corners identical and all edges identical) than an Illegal cube, albeit with a lot more parts. Oskar and Lee Tutt will need to collaborate on that one.

The question remains, what is the maximum theoretical difference angle to which a puzzle can be fudged???

If a 30 degree fudge difference can in fact be realized, then the "Illegal Triangular Prism" and "Fully Functional Face-Turning Snub Cube" may some day come to fruition as well :o

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