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 Post subject: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 5:26 am 
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As I searched through the Internet, I've seen quite a few simulations for various kinds of twisty puzzles.

However, I have never seen any simulations for puzzles that change shapes when scrambled, except for the Square-1 simulator in Puzzler.

Does anyone know nice shape-shifting puzzle simulations that I'm missing?

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 7:41 am 
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I've got a few on my website - 3x3x3 octagonal barrel, Battenberg and 2x2x2 octagonal barrel.

I was considering the 2x2x2 circle cube but I was unsure which centres rotated with which faces after the first move.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:36 pm 
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MarkSS wrote:
I've got a few on my website - 3x3x3 octagonal barrel, Battenberg and 2x2x2 octagonal barrel.

I was considering the 2x2x2 circle cube but I was unsure which centres rotated with which faces after the first move.


After studying the video aleh posted on his ebay auction page, I realized that the corner piece with blue, white, and orange colors has the outer and circle pieces glued together.

So, turning any face that contains this corner will also turn the center.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 2:15 am 
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I know right?!?!?!?!
There is certainly a lack of shape-shifter sims out there.

That's why I'm working on my own version!!!!!! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:

I've been working on it off and on for about 3 years now, and everytime I thought I had a program that could simulate EVERY twisty puzzle imaginable, I realize I had forgotten about bandaging, or forgotten that some puzzles are solved mid twist..... and then along came the idea of jumbleability..... and I just got totally lost.......
The reason they are very rare is that the mathematics behind displaying 3D graphics correctly gets very complicated and non-shape shifting puzzles can "cheat" a little bit to have simpler displays.

If I can get some sort of Camtasia on my computer I can record some of it in action. But I guess for now a few pictures will have to do.

Schoolwork is keeping me incredibly busy right now and this a long way from being finished so don't expect anything but possibly a demo for a long time. Sorry.... :cry:

Peace


Attachments:
File comment: The first puzzle I simulated was a Mastermorphix.
Mastermorphix.jpg
Mastermorphix.jpg [ 30.76 KiB | Viewed 2897 times ]
File comment: A Mental Block (made by Tony Fisher) in mid turn.
MentalBlock.jpg
MentalBlock.jpg [ 23.75 KiB | Viewed 3906 times ]
File comment: The infamous Container by Tony Fisher. (So at least I KINDA own one :) )
Container.jpg
Container.jpg [ 21.58 KiB | Viewed 3906 times ]
File comment: A shape-mod of a Little Chop. This puzzle's natural shape is a tetrahedron.
TetraChop.jpg
TetraChop.jpg [ 24.36 KiB | Viewed 3904 times ]
File comment: And, just for fun, a MASTER Mental Block... if it existed :)
MasterMentalBlock.jpg
MasterMentalBlock.jpg [ 33.94 KiB | Viewed 2896 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 2:21 am 
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Wow, very impressive! :lol:

Really nice work Allagem. I can't wait for the finished software. :D


ps. If you can, please make the program compatible with Mac OSX, too. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 2:23 am 
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Yes, very nice software!

I second leonid's PS.

:)

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 2:27 am 
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Thanks, it took a LOOOOOONG time to get where it is and it's not even finished yet.

Really the whole reason I made this was to play with a Golden Cube without buying one because they used to be REALLY expensive (well originals still ARE) but seeing as Tony allowed them to be mass produced... it kinda just died. The old puzzles still work but I'm not really sure if this has a future or not.

My friends and family have suggested I finish it up, meaning making it capable of simulating ANY puzzle (including jumbleables) and then trying to sell it as a program in a way that I can constantly be creating more virtual puzzles for anyone who has bought the software.

I'm not so sure if this would work, but it is an idea..... :?

Peace


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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 2:46 am 
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Nice idea. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 3:51 am 
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Wow, that looks really cool. I personally don't care about jumbleability... but anyway your program looks like it can simulate a bunch of really cool things that other programs can't, so I think a lot of people would benefit from it if you released it. By the way... would it be too much to ask to add a timer? :)

Can the program support "impossible" puzzles such as the edges-only 3x3, even megaminxes, and Brillicube?

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:12 pm 
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qqwref wrote:
Can the program support "impossible" puzzles such as the edges-only 3x3, even megaminxes, and Brillicube?


Actually, the one thing my program CANNOT do is support puzzles with non-planar cuts....so, no, it can't do any of those exactly the way you may want. It CAN however support puzzles with holes in it, so it can support puzzles that are equivalent to all the above mentioned. It can also support for example a pyraminx-looking puzzle that turns like a cube. In real life this won't work unless something is pillowed or stretched because it would be possible to seperate a corner piece from the rest of the puzzle so it's only touching by a point, things like that.

As far as a timer goes, sure, that's a piece a cake to add, but first the program has to recognize when you've solved the puzzle... :wink: which it currently can't do, and when you think about it, is quite tricky to define on shape shifting puzzles

Would many people be interested in purchasing this if I were to sell it? If so, it would be capable of supporting ANY puzzle with planar cuts, including jumbleable puzzles, puzzles with "floating" pieces, ANYTHING with planar cuts. I could be constantly writing files with new puzzles that would be free for anyone who already purchased the software. If enough people say yes, I will certainly look into it this summer :)

Peace


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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 1:36 pm 
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Show me a demo that runs on Linux(or a least runs under Wine), and I would gladly pay a reasonable sum for the full version. The only tips I can give for attempting Wine compatibility are to use OpenGL for 3D-Rendering and avoid things like the .Net Framework.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 6:14 pm 
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I'd definitely be interested in this software. I would of course like to see a demo first, though. And as I mentioned above, it would have to be mac compatible. Price could also possibly be a factor, but most likely not.

Also, you say that you could be writing new puzzles to give to us free. Why would you need to do this? Can't we simply make the puzzles ourselves? I mean, sure it would be nice to give us a few common puzzles to start with, but I had imagined that this would be similar to UMC.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 7:53 pm 
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Yes, ofcourse I would make a demo first, wouldn't exactly be fair otherwise right??

Remember that in UMC you are limited by many things, the final shape of the puzzle and the inability to shape-shift being two of them, so it's impossible to classify all puzzles in such a simplistic way. For example, how would you make a Container in UMC, or how would you propose my software have a setup similar to UMC that would allow the creation of a Container. It gets complicated....

I am not against letting others make their own puzzles but the file for each puzzle is quite long and complicated and very easy to screwup and make an incredibly glitchy puzzles (which is sometimes fun to play with :wink: )

If you have already seen my Block Dude program you'll know that the only programming language I know is Java, and I'm a really, really amateur programmer - I just have really good ideas and patience to make things up. So I really know next to nothing about Linux, Wine, OpenGL, .Net Framework, or how to make anything I write compatible withMac OSX. My entire code is clever usage of doubles booleans for loops and classes :P That's all I know!!!! :?

So I will need to learn alot!!!! (if anyone wants to help or point to good places to learn stuff please feel free :) )
And as I have already said, my schedule is becoming increasingly more crowded as we draw nearer to finals - so this thing won't even get off the ground until summer - be patient :)

Peace

PS I'm starting to feel bad about hijacking this thread.... leonid, if you want me to start a new thread for this let me know :oops:


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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 7:57 pm 
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Allagem wrote:
PS I'm starting to feel bad about hijacking this thread.... leonid, if you want me to start a new thread for this let me know :oops:


No problem at all. Your comments were exactly the kind of responses I hoped to get.

Also, if you are using only pure Java to make software, the program will be compatible with all major platforms.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2009 8:25 pm 
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Allagem wrote:
Remember that in UMC you are limited by many things, the final shape of the puzzle and the inability to shape-shift being two of them, so it's impossible to classify all puzzles in such a simplistic way. For example, how would you make a Container in UMC, or how would you propose my software have a setup similar to UMC that would allow the creation of a Container. It gets complicated....

I am not against letting others make their own puzzles but the file for each puzzle is quite long and complicated and very easy to screwup and make an incredibly glitchy puzzles (which is sometimes fun to play with :wink: )

Yes, I do see what you mean now. It would be very hard (if not impossible) to allow people to make absolutely any polyhedron with any cut planes they wanted, especially so with shape changing puzzles.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 2:55 pm 
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Java Bytecode can run on any system with a Java Virtual Machine, so as long as you leave the final program as a jar instead of creating a standalone exe, it should work fine on Linux and OSX.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2009 9:14 pm 
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Allagem wrote:
Would many people be interested in purchasing this if I were to sell it? If so, it would be capable of supporting ANY puzzle with planar cuts, including jumbleable puzzles, puzzles with "floating" pieces, ANYTHING with planar cuts. I could be constantly writing files with new puzzles that would be free for anyone who already purchased the software. If enough people say yes, I will certainly look into it this summer :)

I already now wish to get your program!
Once I have bought UMC, and the author a month later has made its free, but I do not regret about it...

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2009 11:58 am 
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I spent a couple of hours this morning adding a Bump Cube to my Java and Pocket PC games.
Java Link
PocketPC Link
Attachment:
Bump.png
Bump.png [ 28.23 KiB | Viewed 2895 times ]

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Last edited by MarkSS on Mon Jun 08, 2009 1:11 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Shape-shifting twisty puzzle simulations?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 07, 2009 3:08 pm 
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MarkSS wrote:
I spent a couple of hours this morning adding a Bump Cube to my Java and Pocket PC games.
Java Link
PocketPC Link
Attachment:
Bump.png

i think that one member voltaire (im not sure how to spell it) did that sticker mod.

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