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 Post subject: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Tue Aug 05, 2008 6:00 pm 
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OK, so Tony got things started with this post, but I think think many of us are still left wondering, well, how much more can it take? Many want to know, but have posted "not at the cost of my puzzle". So why don't we share the cost?

I propose a "how strong is a V-Cube 7x7x7" Paypal fund. Once it reaches the cost of a new 7x7x7 (which shipping, of course), bombs away! I could start at a set height and just keep going higher until it breaks. Or play baseball with it and measure distance. Or you suggest a stress test, but unless the fund is very popular we can probably only break it once.

I plan on doing an order for a black 5x5x5 V-Cube soon, so adding a 7x7x7 will be easy and cheap to ship along with it. I can get started with my existing 7x7x7 if I know a new one is on the way.

If people are generous, I'm sure I could add a Rubik's and East Sheen 5x5x5 to comparison purposes, but I refuse to drop my Bandelow 5x5x5 :)

All remaining parts would go to my general puzzle building bag, although I would certainly be willing to offer them at reasonable prices for those needing replacement pieces.

Any interest in donating to the cause? PM your interest and donation amount. If we reach the right number I will update the thread and let people know where to paypal the money and we'll have our answer.

Dave

P.S. I love puzzles and normally this idea would seem very, very wrong. But this is for science!

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 10:55 am 
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Love the idea. It would be painful watching a 7x7 destroyed intentionally before I could afford my own though. Got a some suggestions for stress tests though.

*** Long post***
**A list will be added as a P.P.S. if you want to skip the rambling**

Hypothesis
The V-Cube versions 5x5x5, 6x6x6, and 7x7x7 can take take a considerable amount of external stress either equal to, or greater than the sequential movement puzzles already on the market.

1. Dryer Test. - Repetetive external shock in a controlled environment.
Materials
A. Clothes dryer (prefereably not pay per load, would get expensive)
B. 2 Rubik's brand 3x3x3
C. 2 Rubik's brand 5x5x5
D. 2 Meffert's Brand 5x5x5
E. 2 V-Cube Brand 5x5x5
F. 2 V-Cube Brand 6x6x6
G. 2 V-Cube Brand 7x7x7
Additional Materials(Optional)
Cheap brands of all available sizes
Rubiks and Mefferts version 4x4x4
Rubiks and Mefferts version 2x2x2

Procedure
With one of each cube Set up a table and a chair near (but secluded from) the clothes dryer. Test every cube and place into the dryer compartment. Take the other set of cubes (one of each) and label them "Control". Test them and then leave them on the table. Turn the dryer on a cool setting and let run for a full cycle. The control group should not be touched during the experiment. After the dryer cycle remove all the cubes (and potential broken pieces) and catalog visible damage. Each cube should then be tested, and compared to the control group.
Secondary Procedure (optional)
Repeat the same experiment (possibly with a third set of cubes) in a hot cycle in the dryer with the added stress of high heat on the plastics of the cubes. Same control group should be used as control. You may also for fun add tiled versions of the puzzles as well, but that would be a lot of data and outside of the Declared Hypothesis.

2. Rotation test - Repetive Twisting with controlled speed.
Materials
Same cubes as mentioned before (If a cube is already damaged, use a good portion of, or a brand new cube)
Drill Press
Custom bit
Adjustable Clamp Locked into place on Press
Leather scraps
Timer
Optional Materials
More drills for each cube (of the same brand and model) to save time
More clamps for same reason
More everything actually
Procedure
Control group and test group should be tested and segregated as before. A special bit needs to be built (or purchased if something does exist) that would enable you to turn the puzzle with the drill. Place a Cube in the Clamp, surrounded by the leather scraps to avoid damage, so that the puzzle will not move except for the outermost layer. Affix bit to drill, then to cube. Turn on low speed and start timer. Stop timer at first pop, crack, or signs of smoke. Record time and damage. Continue same procedure with every layer of the cube (3x3 would have two tests - top layer, top two layers, the 4x4x4 would have 3 tests - Top layer, Top two layers, top three layers). If a cube lasts more than five minutes, stop the test. Repeat on a higher setting.
Secondary Procedures
If you can find some way to isolate inner slices, all combinations of faces should be tested. Thus giving the 3x3 3 tests ( Top, Middle, Top two) and the 4x4 would have 6 tests ( Top, Top center, Bottom center, Middle two, top two, top three). This would add a lot of time and the clamping would be quite intricate as well.
If a cube does not show signs of stress, simply connect it up and let it run until something breaks. Record time. This would also be a long test if a cube is well adapted to continuous turning. I would guess at high speed no cube would last 5 minutes anyway.

3. Gravity Test (previously mentioned) - Cubes dropped from a predetermined height onto a solid surface.
Materials
Flat level surface (concrete would be ideal)
Cubes
Metered back drop (like on mythbusters) to show height
Releasing device (human should be avoided to promote consistency)
Spare parts
Procedure
Test and segregate as before. Drop each cube (flat side down) from a predetermined set of heights (possibly every half foot/meter depending on preference). Record height, rebound height, any visible damage, then test each cube before the next drop. Also record if the cube twists midair and lands on any surface other than the down side. If a puzzle damages a removable piece (not the core), replace it and continue from the next height.
Secondary Procedure
Repeat all tests but drop cubes corner down.

Got tired writing out in full, the next ones are therefore short and general.

4. Speed Test - Cubes launched at speed for, I don't know, air resistance ?
Two words....Air cannon ( if an air cannon cannot be found/built, how about batting cage machine?) Oh and launch them into something soft, this isn't a collison test :)

5. Reverse Velocity - Cubes launched at a set speed then velocity reversed by external force (baseball bat)
Prefereably done in a way pieces can be retrieved. IOW not in a batting cage where a tiny piece can go into the grass outside and never found.

6. Wet heat test - Take test cubes into sauna (leave control outside) and tested by a cuber.
7. Dry heat test - Desert? Needs to be quite warm...over 95 deg F
8. Wet Cold test - Polar swim anyone? Dry suit and breathing Assistance required
9. Dry Cold test - Walk in freezer....take a sweater.
10. Frozen cube - Freeze cube use in moderate ambient temperature (living room).
11. Squishy cube - Heat up somehow (oven may be too hot) and test in moderate ambient temperature.
12. Old West test - Tie to the back of a car/horse and drag it...in dirt they will last longer...and yes i'm finally out of ideas.

Remember safety is the most important thing here. Don't kill yourself in the name of science. Or break any bones, or get hypothermia, or burn yourself etc etc.

Also, see if Verdes would send you video of him testing his own cubes. Such as the punt test, or the at the computer to the floor slam.

Any other ideas out there?

-adam-

P.S. You could also gather some friends and play a game/activity with it - basketball, soccer, football, shot put, pool/billiards, kickball, hockey, curling, baseball, water polo, cmon the possibilites are as endless as......

How about follow along the Olympics with a V-Cube....

P.P.S. Short list -

1. Dryer Test. - Repetetive external shock in a controlled environment.
2. Rotation test - Repetive Twisting with controlled speed.
3. Gravity Test (previously mentioned) - Cubes dropped from a predetermined height onto a solid surface.
4. Speed Test - Cubes launched at speed for, I don't know, air resistance ?
5. Reverse Velocity - Cubes launched at a set speed then velocity reversed by external force (baseball bat)
6. Wet heat test - Take test cubes into sauna (leave control outside) and tested by a cuber.
7. Dry heat test - Desert? Needs to be quite warm...over 95 deg F
8. Wet Cold test - Polar swim anyone? Dry suit and breathing Assistance required
9. Dry Cold test - Walk in freezer....take a sweater.
10. Frozen cube - Freeze cube use in moderate ambient temperature (living room).
11. Squishy cube - Heat up somehow (oven may be too hot) and test in moderate ambient temperature.
12. Old West test - Tie to the back of a car/horse and drag it...in dirt they will last longer...and yes i'm finally out of ideas.

_________________
The first ten million years, they were the worst.
The second ten million years, they were the worst too.
The third ten million years I didn't like at all.
After that, I went into a bit of a decline.
<i>Marvin the Paranoid Android</i>


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 12:01 pm 
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Location: Greece, Australia, Thailand, India, Singapore.
wronginthehead wrote:
P.P.S. Short list -

1. Dryer Test. - Repetetive external shock in a controlled environment.
2. Rotation test - Repetive Twisting with controlled speed.
3. Gravity Test (previously mentioned) - Cubes dropped from a predetermined height onto a solid surface.
4. Speed Test - Cubes launched at speed for, I don't know, air resistance ?
5. Reverse Velocity - Cubes launched at a set speed then velocity reversed by external force (baseball bat)
6. Wet heat test - Take test cubes into sauna (leave control outside) and tested by a cuber.
7. Dry heat test - Desert? Needs to be quite warm...over 95 deg F
8. Wet Cold test - Polar swim anyone? Dry suit and breathing Assistance required
9. Dry Cold test - Walk in freezer....take a sweater.
10. Frozen cube - Freeze cube use in moderate ambient temperature (living room).
11. Squishy cube - Heat up somehow (oven may be too hot) and test in moderate ambient temperature.
12. Old West test - Tie to the back of a car/horse and drag it...in dirt they will last longer...and yes i'm finally out of ideas.


This is a very amusing post. Let me also add the... electrocution test!

:lol:


Pantazis

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 12:16 pm 
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wronginthehead wrote:
Love the idea. It would be painful watching a 7x7 destroyed intentionally before I could afford my own though. Got a some suggestions for stress tests though.

*** Long post***
**A list will be added as a P.P.S. if you want to skip the rambling**

Hypothesis
The V-Cube versions 5x5x5, 6x6x6, and 7x7x7 can take take a considerable amount of external stress either equal to, or greater than the sequential movement puzzles already on the market.

1. Dryer Test. - Repetetive external shock in a controlled environment.
Materials
A. Clothes dryer (prefereably not pay per load, would get expensive)
B. 2 Rubik's brand 3x3x3
C. 2 Rubik's brand 5x5x5
D. 2 Meffert's Brand 5x5x5
E. 2 V-Cube Brand 5x5x5
F. 2 V-Cube Brand 6x6x6
G. 2 V-Cube Brand 7x7x7
Additional Materials(Optional)
Cheap brands of all available sizes
Rubiks and Mefferts version 4x4x4
Rubiks and Mefferts version 2x2x2

Procedure
With one of each cube Set up a table and a chair near (but secluded from) the clothes dryer. Test every cube and place into the dryer compartment. Take the other set of cubes (one of each) and label them "Control". Test them and then leave them on the table. Turn the dryer on a cool setting and let run for a full cycle. The control group should not be touched during the experiment. After the dryer cycle remove all the cubes (and potential broken pieces) and catalog visible damage. Each cube should then be tested, and compared to the control group.
Secondary Procedure (optional)
Repeat the same experiment (possibly with a third set of cubes) in a hot cycle in the dryer with the added stress of high heat on the plastics of the cubes. Same control group should be used as control. You may also for fun add tiled versions of the puzzles as well, but that would be a lot of data and outside of the Declared Hypothesis.

2. Rotation test - Repetive Twisting with controlled speed.
Materials
Same cubes as mentioned before (If a cube is already damaged, use a good portion of, or a brand new cube)
Drill Press
Custom bit
Adjustable Clamp Locked into place on Press
Leather scraps
Timer
Optional Materials
More drills for each cube (of the same brand and model) to save time
More clamps for same reason
More everything actually
Procedure
Control group and test group should be tested and segregated as before. A special bit needs to be built (or purchased if something does exist) that would enable you to turn the puzzle with the drill. Place a Cube in the Clamp, surrounded by the leather scraps to avoid damage, so that the puzzle will not move except for the outermost layer. Affix bit to drill, then to cube. Turn on low speed and start timer. Stop timer at first pop, crack, or signs of smoke. Record time and damage. Continue same procedure with every layer of the cube (3x3 would have two tests - top layer, top two layers, the 4x4x4 would have 3 tests - Top layer, Top two layers, top three layers). If a cube lasts more than five minutes, stop the test. Repeat on a higher setting.
Secondary Procedures
If you can find some way to isolate inner slices, all combinations of faces should be tested. Thus giving the 3x3 3 tests ( Top, Middle, Top two) and the 4x4 would have 6 tests ( Top, Top center, Bottom center, Middle two, top two, top three). This would add a lot of time and the clamping would be quite intricate as well.
If a cube does not show signs of stress, simply connect it up and let it run until something breaks. Record time. This would also be a long test if a cube is well adapted to continuous turning. I would guess at high speed no cube would last 5 minutes anyway.

3. Gravity Test (previously mentioned) - Cubes dropped from a predetermined height onto a solid surface.
Materials
Flat level surface (concrete would be ideal)
Cubes
Metered back drop (like on mythbusters) to show height
Releasing device (human should be avoided to promote consistency)
Spare parts
Procedure
Test and segregate as before. Drop each cube (flat side down) from a predetermined set of heights (possibly every half foot/meter depending on preference). Record height, rebound height, any visible damage, then test each cube before the next drop. Also record if the cube twists midair and lands on any surface other than the down side. If a puzzle damages a removable piece (not the core), replace it and continue from the next height.
Secondary Procedure
Repeat all tests but drop cubes corner down.

Got tired writing out in full, the next ones are therefore short and general.

4. Speed Test - Cubes launched at speed for, I don't know, air resistance ?
Two words....Air cannon ( if an air cannon cannot be found/built, how about batting cage machine?) Oh and launch them into something soft, this isn't a collison test :)

5. Reverse Velocity - Cubes launched at a set speed then velocity reversed by external force (baseball bat)
Prefereably done in a way pieces can be retrieved. IOW not in a batting cage where a tiny piece can go into the grass outside and never found.

6. Wet heat test - Take test cubes into sauna (leave control outside) and tested by a cuber.
7. Dry heat test - Desert? Needs to be quite warm...over 95 deg F
8. Wet Cold test - Polar swim anyone? Dry suit and breathing Assistance required
9. Dry Cold test - Walk in freezer....take a sweater.
10. Frozen cube - Freeze cube use in moderate ambient temperature (living room).
11. Squishy cube - Heat up somehow (oven may be too hot) and test in moderate ambient temperature.
12. Old West test - Tie to the back of a car/horse and drag it...in dirt they will last longer...and yes i'm finally out of ideas.

Remember safety is the most important thing here. Don't kill yourself in the name of science. Or break any bones, or get hypothermia, or burn yourself etc etc.

Also, see if Verdes would send you video of him testing his own cubes. Such as the punt test, or the at the computer to the floor slam.

Any other ideas out there?

-adam-

P.S. You could also gather some friends and play a game/activity with it - basketball, soccer, football, shot put, pool/billiards, kickball, hockey, curling, baseball, water polo, cmon the possibilites are as endless as......

How about follow along the Olympics with a V-Cube....

P.P.S. Short list -

1. Dryer Test. - Repetetive external shock in a controlled environment.
2. Rotation test - Repetive Twisting with controlled speed.
3. Gravity Test (previously mentioned) - Cubes dropped from a predetermined height onto a solid surface.
4. Speed Test - Cubes launched at speed for, I don't know, air resistance ?
5. Reverse Velocity - Cubes launched at a set speed then velocity reversed by external force (baseball bat)
6. Wet heat test - Take test cubes into sauna (leave control outside) and tested by a cuber.
7. Dry heat test - Desert? Needs to be quite warm...over 95 deg F
8. Wet Cold test - Polar swim anyone? Dry suit and breathing Assistance required
9. Dry Cold test - Walk in freezer....take a sweater.
10. Frozen cube - Freeze cube use in moderate ambient temperature (living room).
11. Squishy cube - Heat up somehow (oven may be too hot) and test in moderate ambient temperature.
12. Old West test - Tie to the back of a car/horse and drag it...in dirt they will last longer...and yes i'm finally out of ideas.


Can you elaborate please? :D


DLitwin, If people were donating to the fund then why not have the pieces freely available to everyone. If someone loses or breaks a piece they could take out of the kitty.

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 12:22 pm 
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Small detail:

There isn't a specific "Meffert's 5x5." I suggest substituting the Eastsheen A5, which is the 5x5 Meffert currently sells.


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 12:42 pm 
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If a test is done I would suggest shooting it with one of these. http://www.kitestailstoys.com/product.p ... ctid=17237 :D :D

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 1:07 pm 
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Tony Fisher wrote:
DLitwin, If people were donating to the fund then why not have the pieces freely available to everyone. If someone loses or breaks a piece they could take out of the kitty.

I get dibbs on the core!
:)


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 1:20 pm 
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Send it to "Will it Blend?"

It might give some members here heart attacks.


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 1:48 pm 
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It would be awesome if you launched the 7x7 out of a potato cannon (as long as all necessary precautions were observed, lol).


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:00 pm 
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Location: USA
lol great ideas guys :)

Tony Fisher wrote:
Can you elaborate please? :D

I felt I described the tests very well. Plus, my fingers were getting tired. What do you need elaborated? I can certainly add more detail. I pulled back for ease of reading.

VeryWetPaint wrote:
Small detail:
There isn't a specific "Meffert's 5x5." I suggest substituting the Eastsheen A5, which is the 5x5 Meffert currently sells.

Good catch. I of course meant Eastsheen and not Meffert's. For clarification sake, all mefferts are technically eastsheen correct?

kastellorizo wrote:
This is a very amusing post. Let me also add the... electrocution test!

And how would this go? I don't believe cubes are conductive.... and if you used a large enough spark to arc over a cube, you would simply melt it, although that would be fun :twisted:

One last thing...I just thought that the results of many of these tests would be significantly different when using riveted cubes vs. cubes with screws. We would of course need to add are variant fasteners to the group.

_________________
The first ten million years, they were the worst.
The second ten million years, they were the worst too.
The third ten million years I didn't like at all.
After that, I went into a bit of a decline.
<i>Marvin the Paranoid Android</i>


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:03 pm 
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Location: Bay Area, CA
Tony Fisher wrote:
DLitwin, If people were donating to the fund then why not have the pieces freely available to everyone. If someone loses or breaks a piece they could take out of the kitty.

Sounds reasonable, with preference going to those that donate, of course :)

So lets get pledging! The fund is off to an impressive start (over $50!) but we still have half way to go. Large pledges are appreciated but nothing is too small. Remember, only 20 people at $5 will do it. With the fund where it is, we only need perhaps 10 more at this small level. $5 to see a 7x7x7 drop? How about $3?

Pledges will remain anonymous unless you want to mention it yourself.

Dave

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:06 pm 
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wronginthehead wrote:
lol great ideas guys :)

Tony Fisher wrote:
Can you elaborate please? :D

I felt I described the tests very well. Plus, my fingers were getting tired. What do you need elaborated? I can certainly add more detail. I pulled back for ease of reading.


Relax, you're taking it far too seriously.

Tony was being sarcastic and making light hearted fun of the fact that your wrote such a detail account of each test (I think!)

The tests sound like great fun will be interesting, good publicity for V-Cubes as well.


Last edited by Bounb on Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 2:21 pm 
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Quote:
Relax, you're taking it far too seriously.

Tony was being sarcastic and making light hearted fun of the fact that your wrote such a detail account of each test.
Sounds like great fun


wow....my sarcasm sensor must be broken...lol

_________________
The first ten million years, they were the worst.
The second ten million years, they were the worst too.
The third ten million years I didn't like at all.
After that, I went into a bit of a decline.
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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:21 pm 
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Wouldn't the reverse velocity and the gravity test be the same? It is an object striking another object at some speed. Yay relativity!

What we need is a high speed camera


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 3:41 pm 
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TBTTyler wrote:
What we need is a high speed camera

Sorry, 30fps is the best my 1998 Sony TRV-900 will do. 15fps progressive, but that is just too slow.

Regarding the large list of suggested tests (thanks wronginthehead!) I think we'll stick with the initial drop test for now. To test all those things propery we'd need a new cube for each, and right now I'll just hope we can get the funds for one.

Also, after a certain point my respect for the Verdes family and their staff overwhelms my interest in destroying a great product purely to see what it can take. The (well justified) claims of robustness make this point a bit past the drop test for me but not too much further.

I know I said this was for science but I am only human, not a cube crushing robot. And you don't want to see me crying on camera;)

Dave

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 5:25 pm 
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TBTTyler wrote:
Wouldn't the reverse velocity and the gravity test be the same? It is an object striking another object at some speed. Yay relativity!


I believe the reverse velocity test would enable higher speeds. One, the bat would add speed where the floor wouldn't, and second dropping would only allow you to reach terminal velocity, IF you can get high enough to reach such speed before you hit the ground. I suspect you would be able to inflict more damage with the bat then you could rationally reach by dropping it. (You would get high enough that you would have to be in a controlled environment or wind could cause too much variance)
DLitwin wrote:
Regarding the large list of suggested tests (thanks wronginthehead!) I think we'll stick with the initial drop test for now. To test all those things propery we'd need a new cube for each, and right now I'll just hope we can get the funds for one.

Also, after a certain point my respect for the Verdes family and their staff overwhelms my interest in destroying a great product purely to see what it can take. The (well justified) claims of robustness make this point a bit past the drop test for me but not too much further.

I know I said this was for science but I am only human, not a cube crushing robot. And you don't want to see me crying on camera;)

Dave

Agree with the point about Verdes, and the crying. If the funds do get high enough, maybe we just test the 3x3 on some of the other tests and leave the 7x7x7 to the drop test. Since the 3x3 is cheaper and readily available, it would be easier to collect enough cubes to test.

_________________
The first ten million years, they were the worst.
The second ten million years, they were the worst too.
The third ten million years I didn't like at all.
After that, I went into a bit of a decline.
<i>Marvin the Paranoid Android</i>


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 6:23 pm 
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combustion test
take an adequatly beat up 7x7, soak in gasoline, ignite in parkinglot, post on youtube


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 8:46 pm 
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A quick question. Did Meffeert's ever make their own 5x5? I'm asking because, I purchased one in 1994 from his company. I can't remember if Eastsheen was around then. I next purchased his tiled version round about 1997 or 1998. Are those cubes NOT his own? Mind, I haven't taken any of the 5x5's apart to compare internal parts. Does anyone knowledgable know the difference?

Second thought. I have an ISIS. When it got screwed back together, the placenta's were misaligned and it sat on my desk for months in that state. One day about a month ago I decided I wanted it open. I managed to get the placenta's realigned, but that was about it. (I froze it overnight, then tossed it in a hot oven for 5 minutes, put on some rubber gloves, and did a very quick, very hot turn.) Now I still couldn't get it to open, so my next step was to drop it on the playground from the top of the Monkey bars. Still no luck, then I got the brilliant Idea to pitch it from the balcony. 28 floors is a bit high, and I was afraid of missing the mark, and hurting someone, or the puzzle, so instead I took it to a friends flat and pitched it out the 3rd floor window. It has a nice little ding on the bottom so I know it landed the right way, but still not open. Would the V-cube take a 3 story fall?

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Wed Aug 06, 2008 9:26 pm 
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katsmom wrote:
Did Meffeert's ever make their own 5x5?[\quote]
I believe they sold a Rubik's or Kroll design before the ES variety, didn't they? What size is yours? That should tell you what it is and where it may have come from.

katsmom wrote:
...Would the V-cube take a 3 story fall?

If it survives more than about 10 feet I'll have to take it to work where I can drop it from a five level parking garage.

Pledge and see!

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 12:24 am 
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If you want, I can drop it from a 7 story parking garage at the Mall of America and film it.

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 1:17 am 
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katsmom wrote:
A quick question. Did Meffeert's ever make their own 5x5? I'm asking because, I purchased one in 1994 from his company. I can't remember if Eastsheen was around then. I next purchased his tiled version round about 1997 or 1998. Are those cubes NOT his own? Mind, I haven't taken any of the 5x5's apart to compare internal parts. Does anyone knowledgable know the difference?
It's been debated before, but I don't have a link for it (yet). Briefly, to avoid getting off-topic, Meffert has sold a variety of 5x5's and many were shown to be cubes from other sources (but AFAIK not all of them). For example Meffert's early 90's 5x5 (with stickers) is clearly identical to the Rubik's Wahn, Krell, and Bandelow 5x5 cubes. Don't abuse any of these!!


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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 9:15 am 
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katsmom wrote:
A quick question. Did Meffeert's ever make their own 5x5? I'm asking because, I purchased one in 1994 from his company. I can't remember if Eastsheen was around then. I next purchased his tiled version round about 1997 or 1998. Are those cubes NOT his own? Mind, I haven't taken any of the 5x5's apart to compare internal parts. Does anyone knowledgable know the difference?

Seeing as the patents for the Eastsheen (seen here) don't predate 1997, I would have to assume that is a Krell/Wahn.

To my knowledge, Meffert has not produced a 5x5 of his design.

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:25 pm 
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Thanks for that Noah. I was pretty sure they weren't Eastsheens. I remember seeing Eastsheen at one of the first toys and games fairs I went to. Any idea how to tell what type they are? I know it's a stupid question, but can you tell from looking at the outside, or do they need to be taken apart? And for that matter, can you tell from the inside? I'm just curious, definatly not selling them.

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:31 pm 
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katsmom wrote:
Thanks for that Noah. I was pretty sure they weren't Eastsheens. I remember seeing Eastsheen at one of the first toys and games fairs I went to. Any idea how to tell what type they are? I know it's a stupid question, but can you tell from looking at the outside, or do they need to be taken apart? And for that matter, can you tell from the inside? I'm just curious, definatly not selling them.

Size is the easiest indicator. The ES is 60mm (both the 4x4x4 and 5x5x5 are the same, as they are based on very similar internals) and the Rubik's/Krell is 70mm. The ES will be lighter, move very smoothly, but not cut any corners.

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 12:23 am 
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katsmom wrote:
Thanks for that Noah. I was pretty sure they weren't Eastsheens. I remember seeing Eastsheen at one of the first toys and games fairs I went to. Any idea how to tell what type they are? I know it's a stupid question, but can you tell from looking at the outside, or do they need to be taken apart? And for that matter, can you tell from the inside? I'm just curious, definatly not selling them.

Lots of questions there...

How to tell what type they are? David Litwin is right, the size is a useful guide. But the history you gave is another helpful indication. If the cube is a member of the Wahn/Krell/Bandelow family it will have shiny (not textured) stickers with white-opposite-blue, green-opposite-yellow, and red-opposite-orange. (Some Bandelow cubes may have a color scheme without white.) The orange will be a bright, fluorescent shade that reacts to black light. Some cubes of this family have curling stickers on the orange side, but AFAIK the ones from Meffert don't have this problem.

Do they need to be taken apart? Not really. Based on the vintage, the cube is doubtless a member of this family. The interiors and exteriors are essentially indistinguishible. (But see the pictures here if you're curious!)

Can you tell from the inside? Yes, cubes from the Wahn/Krell/Bandelow family have arbitrary letters molded into the back side of the parts, probably to help identify which injection mold they came from. When disassembled, the letters are most noticeable on the middle-edge pieces. Some pieces have an & ampersand instead of a letter.

Following David Litwin's lead with his Megaminx, I'd like to poke around inside a few of these cubes and see if there are any other clues about their histories. (I've already done this with the early 4x4's but I amassed so much data I haven't gotten around to posting it yet!)

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 12:00 pm 
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A video is now up on youtube of Tony Fisher drop kicking a v-cube 7.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjU5R7n_kKU

-Jameson

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 4:37 pm 
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Another idea for a toughness test, get Randy Barnes to use it as a shot put :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 11:11 pm 
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Wow, I can't wait to find out how high a fall a V-cube can fully withstand. My bet would be somewhere between 12-15 feet.

One of my 7x7 center pieces broke today though! :( :( :( Is cubesmith or anyone gonna be offering replacement pieces anytime soon?

Edit: Ironic how the second after I post this, my dad walks into the room and tells me my 6x6 and 7x7 stickers got here today...

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 11:21 pm 
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Rubiksguy wrote:
A video is now up on youtube of Tony Fisher drop kicking a v-cube 7.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xjU5R7n_kKU

-Jameson

Tony made a thread (link in original post) about this video

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 Post subject: Re: V-Cube 7x7x7 stress test fund
PostPosted: Sat Aug 16, 2008 1:22 am 
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numegil wrote:
Wow, I can't wait to find out how high a fall a V-cube can fully withstand. My bet would be somewhere between 12-15 feet.

Well we won't find out if people don't pledge. So far we're half way there, but the second half is going to require some people pitching in. Come on guys, $5? How hard is that? ;)
numegil wrote:
One of my 7x7 center pieces broke today though! :( :( :( Is cubesmith or anyone gonna be offering replacement pieces anytime soon?

How did that happen?

Well if you want a chance at a center piece parts will be available after the drop so perhaps your cheapest option is to pledge some dollars and convince some others to do the same.

Dave

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